The MP and the 15minute city conspiracy

[ClichéGuevara]

People have to be frightened into having more pleasant walkable neighbourhoods?

Do they? How interesting.

I'm not arguing for or against the proposals, I'm simply highlighting some of the flaws in the arguments and justifications, as well as the way they are being pushed, as there is a good potential for better, more acceptable changes to get lost in the fog.

 

[mjr]

There are also official and independent reports by very reputable experts that dispute the claimed reductions in particulate and NOx, but there are probably reasons people can find to ignore those.

Apart from them being disowned by the named experts as quoting them out of context, misinterpreting them, and so on?

It's not particularly off topic, given that some of those claiming opposing views are a conspiracy theory, are using questionable data themselves. Khan himself has done that very thing.

No, people are saying that there are conspiracy theories among the opposition, not that all opposition is conspiracy theories. Do you at least acknowledge the c40 conspiracy theory is being used to oppose the ULEZ expansion?

 

[ClichéGuevara]

Apart from them being disowned by the named experts as quoting them out of context, misinterpreting them, and so on?


No, people are saying that there are conspiracy theories among the opposition, not that all opposition is conspiracy theories. Do you at least acknowledge the c40 conspiracy theory is being used to oppose the ULEZ expansion?

What's been disowned by the named experts? The reports on the ULEZ certainly haven't. There have been some comments from those tasked with backing the scheme, but they don't actually stand up when they're compared to the core data that underpins the claims, such as that from COMEAP.

 

[Andy in Germany]

Do they? How interesting.

I'm not arguing for or against the proposals, I'm simply highlighting some of the flaws in the arguments and justifications, as well as the way they are being pushed, as there is a good potential for better, more acceptable changes to get lost in the fog.

Proposal: Walkable neighbourhoods.
Advantages: Economical to implement, cheaper for residents, pleasant, no need for expensive and unproven technologies, revitalises city centres, decreases health costs due to better health outcomes, more space, less damage to infrastructure and buildings. Better education outcomes, increased standard of living and life expectancy amongst residents.

I'm not sure how much more acceptable you can get than that

Oh, sorry:

Flaws: May stop drivers going wherever they want or slow cars down.

What are the more acceptable alternatives that achieve all of the above and more?

 

[ClichéGuevara]

Proposal: Walkable neighbourhoods.
Advantages: Economical to implement, cheaper for residents, pleasant, no need for expensive and unproven technologies, revitalises city centres, decreases health costs due to better health outcomes, more space, less damage to infrastructure and buildings. Better education outcomes, increased standard of living and life expectancy amongst residents.

I'm not sure how much more acceptable you can get than that

Oh, sorry:

Flaws: May stop drivers going wherever they want or slow cars down.

What are the more acceptable alternatives that achieve all of the above and more?

You seem to be arguing points I haven't raised on topics I didn't engage with, so forgive me if I read that and simply shrug.

That along with others offering newspaper snippets as an argument against robust scientific reports, gives a clue as to why I said previously I was going to bow out, and wished I'd kept my word.

I don't think some people realise that a lot of the arguments they offer, are actually fake news and/or conspiracy theories themselves.

 

[sheddy]

It won’t rest
https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2023/feb/16/15-minute-city-planning-theory-conspiracists

 

[mjr]

It's not surprising that the guardian is pointing out the contradiction, but why aren't the Telegraph and Times asking what's wrong with people being enabled to travel for daily essentials without trackable numberplates on?

 

[FishFright]

We are boned aren't we. The percentage of idiots has hit a critical mass and there's nothing left to be done other than watch Rome burn.

 

[T4tomo]

It's not surprising that the guardian is pointing out the contradiction, but why aren't the Telegraph and Times asking what's wrong with people being enabled to travel for daily essentials without trackable numberplates on?

ANPR cameras have been around for ages and are very widespread, a few more to facilitate limited resident passes thru town / city centres makes no difference at all. Its been illegal to drive without a number plate for a very long time

 

[Milzy]

Why was part 1 closed? People only fear the 15 min city for the future when we have digital I.D’s and the next lock downs will mean if you stray away for a run or ride you’ll be found out and your social credit score will suffer.

 

[Pat "5mph"]

Mod Note:
Thread locked till we merge it with the other one, that was temporarily locked.
Please do not reopen threads on the same topic already locked by the mods team, there is always a reason for the locking.
Cheers!