Tour de France 2025 (CONTAINS SPOILERS!)

Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.

mididoctors

Über Member
IMO their Tour was going to hinge on Ganna, and his going out on Stage 1 was a monster blow for them, and him I'm sure.
I hope to be wrong, but I really struggle to see CR ever becoming a real GC hopeful, at least against the real big guns - I appreciate he has potential, and has showed it in the past, but I really struggle to see him jumping to the next level.

I know Brailsford is back on board now, but I think they are not going to be seeing any huge change in results until their new young signings come through and hopefully develop into race winners, and or in tandem they land a big name such as Evenepoel.

It's all.a bit third tier ... laurance hung onto the GC group on the Mur . Got some riders but no idea how to convert into results. G should try and get laurance into a big break. One of the transition stages. Carcassonne stage or the Jura stage 20 and help him win .,. Those stages have big break written on them
 
Last edited:

Lanterne Rogue

Well-Known Member
Considering their budget, their entire team and management is trash excluding Ganna and Kwiatkowski who are are both not riding with Ganna having crashed out. You could get their results for a fraction of the price.

Bit harsh on Thomas, who ought really to be doing the road captain thing whilst bringing along and sharing his experience with the replacement for whoever was leading the team right now. That he's the first Ineos rider to actually do anything this Tour (in a pointless break) is pretty damning of them, not him.
 

mididoctors

Über Member
Bit harsh on Thomas, who ought really to be doing the road captain thing whilst bringing along and sharing his experience with the replacement for whoever was leading the team right now. That he's the first Ineos rider to actually do anything this Tour (in a pointless break) is pretty damning of them, not him.

It was probably good he stretched his legs . He can shepherd other ineos guys into a break .Foss or laurance
 

stage hunter

Active Member
Considering their budget, their entire team and management is trash excluding Ganna and Kwiatkowski who are are both not riding with Ganna having crashed out. You could get their results for a fraction of the price.

I think judging them on being one of the biggest budgets around is more than a little out of date.

They’ve had a bad tdf for sure but having been very critical of them last year, their season until has been ok.
 

M.R.M

Well-Known Member
I was wondering when you would have something to say.
You might have the wrong impression though. I'm not a hater. I liked them a lot prior to the acquisition from Radcliffe. I don't even have anything against Radcliffe, as I admire what he has achieved in building a massive petrochemical company. I liked Wiggins, Froome, Kwiatkowski, Castroviejo, Rowe, Stannard, Kennaugh. Kwiatkowski was my favourite rider and Team Sky were my favourite team until van der Poel came along.
But I do see them focusing on W/kg monsters, who have trouble with all other aspects of bike riding and thus their riders crashing a ton and having a lot of problems with positioning in the bunch.
I also think it's fair to expect more from teams with huge budgets than from poor teams and Ineos have been declining to the level of or even below French WT teams in that aspect.
Bit harsh on Thomas, who ought really to be doing the road captain thing whilst bringing along and sharing his experience with the replacement for whoever was leading the team right now. That he's the first Ineos rider to actually do anything this Tour (in a pointless break) is pretty damning of them, not him.
Fair. I know the language is strong, but it's somewhat semi serious, tongue in cheek and allows me to be more economical with the words. Otherwise we always have to type so many caveats... 😉
 
Last edited:

M.R.M

Well-Known Member
I think judging them on being one of the biggest budgets around is more than a little out of date.

They’ve had a bad tdf for sure but having been very critical of them last year, their season until has been ok.
Aren't they still a top 4-5 budget? I'd wager only UAE, Visma, Red Bull and Decathlon from next year onwards are higher?

I asked Grok to list it for me and this was the result:
Exact budget figures for WorldTour cycling teams in 2025 are often opaque, as teams rarely disclose precise financials, but based on recent estimates from reputable sources, here are the teams with the highest budgets for the 2025 season, listed in descending order of estimated budget size:

1. **UAE Team Emirates-XRG**: €60 million
- Backed by significant sponsorship from the United Arab Emirates, this team has consistently been at the top with a budget estimated at €60 million, supporting star riders like Tadej Pogačar.

2. **Visma-Lease a Bike**: €50 million
- Supported by sponsors like Jumbo and Visma, their budget is estimated at €50 million, fueling their strong performance in Grand Tours and classics.

3. **Ineos Grenadiers**: €45 million
- Funded by the British multinational Ineos, their budget is estimated at €45 million, maintaining their status as a financial powerhouse despite recent challenges.

4. **Red Bull-Bora-Hansgrohe**: €45 million
- With Red Bull’s backing, this team has a budget estimated at €45 million, bolstered by high-profile riders like Primož Roglič.

5. **Lidl-Trek**: €35 million
- Supported by Lidl and Trek Bicycle Corporation, their budget is estimated at €35 million, reflecting a recent increase due to Lidl’s involvement.

These figures come from posts on X and web reports, particularly from sources like Cyclingnews and Gazzetta dello Sport, which note a significant rise in overall WorldTour budgets, reaching €570 million in 2025. Note that estimates can vary slightly due to sponsorship changes and other financial factors, and some teams, like XDS-Astana, may see budget increases due to new sponsors like XDS Carbon-Tech, potentially pushing them closer to top-tier budgets. Budgets cover rider salaries, staff, travel, equipment, and race fees, with top teams leveraging their financial muscle to attract elite talent and dominate races.[](https://www.domestiquecycling.com/en/budgets-of-worldtour-teams/)[](https://www.cyclingnews.com/news/mens-total-worldtour-budget-reaches-euro570-million-with-average-rider-salary-up-to-euro500000/)[](https://escapecollective.com/whos-riding-what-in-the-2025-worldtour/)
 

mididoctors

Über Member
You might have the wrong impression though. I'm not a hater. I liked them a lot prior to the acquisition from Radcliffe. I don't even have anything against Radcliffe, as I admire what he has achieved in building a massive petrochemical company. I liked Wiggins, Froome, Kwiatkowski, Castroviejo, Rowe, Stannard, Kennaugh. Kwiatkowski was my favourite rider and Team Sky were my favourite team until van der Poel came along.
But I do see them focusing on W/kg monsters, who have trouble with all other aspects of bike riding and thus their riders crashing a ton and having a lot of problems with positioning in the bunch.
I also think it's fair to expect more from teams with huge budgets than from poor teams and Ineos have been declining to the level of or even below French WT teams in that aspect.

Fair. I know the language is strong, but it's somewhat semi serious, tongue in cheek and allows me to be more economical with the words. Otherwise we always have to type so many caveats... 😉

I know your not a hater . I think your largely correct except about Radcliffe who is a c**t .
 

Lanterne Rogue

Well-Known Member
Aren't they still a top 4-5 budget? I'd wager only UAE, Visma, Red Bull and Decathlon from next year onwards are higher?

I asked Grok to list it for me and this was the result:

I'm not sure "I asked a deliberately racist bullshit machine" is evidence for anything, tbh.

If they wanted to refocus on what worked they'd sign a promising but slightly unfocused TT monster who can do ok in the hills (seriously, Remco isn't a bad shout here), a couple of nearly-but-not-quites to make it a pain for anybody else to disrupt them, and back it up with a mixture of experience, wisdom or potential. Problem is that most of the obvious candidates are doing those jobs for other teams and Ineos don't have the budget to just buy them up.

I don't actually think Brailsford's return is bad in this regard? I don't think it's a guarantee of success but he might at least impose some sort of direction. They've been curiously devoid of purpose for a while.
 

M.R.M

Well-Known Member
QS soudal have won 2 stages . One with their team leader . You think the pressure would be off . Doesn't feel like it
For some reason Remco's cycling life is always a telenovela. Max drama, tears, cursing, love, jubilation... Maybe every team he rides for goes through some level of that as well.
QS are a weird team anyway considering they have been mostly successful for decades, but seem to always have money issues and are just slightly better off than being poor. Maybe it's because they are a classics team historically and not a GC team and being a classics team doesn't pay, but I always found it weird that the team that often had the most wins every year (prior to the Pog era) with multiple Monuments, has always been somewhat on the verge of bankruptcy with Bakala seemingly always having one foot out the door and then deciding to recommit at the last minute every time.
 

M.R.M

Well-Known Member
I'm not sure "I asked a deliberately racist bullshit machine" is evidence for anything, tbh.

If they wanted to refocus on what worked they'd sign a promising but slightly unfocused TT monster who can do ok in the hills (seriously, Remco isn't a bad shout here), a couple of nearly-but-not-quites to make it a pain for anybody else to disrupt them, and back it up with a mixture of experience, wisdom or potential. Problem is that most of the obvious candidates are doing those jobs for other teams and Ineos don't have the budget to just buy them up.

I don't actually think Brailsford's return is bad in this regard? I don't think it's a guarantee of success but he might at least impose some sort of direction. They've been curiously devoid of purpose for a while.
Brailsford's return can at worst be a net zero, can it not? At present they are going nowhere and maybe he can find another diamond in the rough. Remco should be a decent signing while they look for the next true GC rider or build up AJ August or Benjamin Noval, but I'm not sure he hasn't already signed for Red Bull.
It would require Pinarello to move to Q36.5 and Specialized to sponsor Ineos, would it not? Additional complications depending on how long those contracts are all running.
 

mididoctors

Über Member
For some reason Remco's cycling life is always a telenovela. Max drama, tears, cursing, love, jubilation... Maybe every team he rides for goes through some level of that as well.
QS are a weird team anyway considering they have been mostly successful for decades, but seem to always have money issues and are just slightly better off than being poor. Maybe it's because they are a classics team historically and not a GC team and being a classics team doesn't pay, but I always found it weird that the team that often had the most wins every year (prior to the Pog era) with multiple Monuments, has always been somewhat on the verge of bankruptcy with Bakala seemingly always having one foot out the door and then deciding to recommit at the last minute every time.

It's weird .....I think it's the Belgium second coming vibe or something. I think he is riding really well . He has some harsh limitations physically compared with his talents . Must be frustrating for him. He's matured too . He was a very young man with idiot takes when he sprung on the scene but has chilled out and is more realistic. He might win a tour if Jonas and pog retire or miss it early enough . That said some one usually explodes on the scene out of nowhere .....
 

Lanterne Rogue

Well-Known Member
I still remember how many Belgians at the worlds in Harrogate wanted to talk to me about Remco. There's a lot going on there beyond his actual ability (and can you imagine what it would be like if he were French?)
 

mididoctors

Über Member
I'm not sure "I asked a deliberately racist bullshit machine" is evidence for anything, tbh.

If they wanted to refocus on what worked they'd sign a promising but slightly unfocused TT monster who can do ok in the hills (seriously, Remco isn't a bad shout here), a couple of nearly-but-not-quites to make it a pain for anybody else to disrupt them, and back it up with a mixture of experience, wisdom or potential. Problem is that most of the obvious candidates are doing those jobs for other teams and Ineos don't have the budget to just buy them up.

I don't actually think Brailsford's return is bad in this regard? I don't think it's a guarantee of success but he might at least impose some sort of direction. They've been curiously devoid of purpose for a while.

I'm pretty sure mechahitler is a true follower of cyclismo
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom