Tour de France 2025 (CONTAINS SPOILERS!)

[Flite]

See you at the TdF femme Avec zwift

No free-to-air in the UK sadly

 

[Pross]

Very good ride by Groves. It must have been tempting to leave it to the sprint and I think the others expected that too.

 

[Basil.B]

Ivan Romeo finished!

 

[stage hunter]

Yellow Jersey win in Paris tomorrow? , will he go for it ?

Maybe. I think after watching him Friday he’s not up to it. At this stage I would wonder whether he will even make the Vuelta.

 

[Pross]

People may be expecting to much from tomorrow. Yes, it’s got the nasty climb but by time they’ve done the processional start it’s going to be a very short stage so won’t be like the Olympic road race was. They may lose the pure sprinters but I still think it will be a fairly big bunch sprinting for the stage win.

 

[13 rider]

Rain on the cobbles could make it pretty sketchy on the descent on to the champs

 

[M.R.M]

La Soulor was awful, they went all in way too early in the race (as in stage number, not which climb). I think they were over-eager after Pog's crash the day before - when you're waiting for Pog to show some possible sign of weakness it's hard to turn your nose up at. I disagree that this was what lost them the Tour and that it was inevitable after then - firstly the main issue of the day turned out to be Jonas having a legitimate bad day on the Hautacam - they could have survived the tactical cock-up (inc. the loss of Jorgenson as a GC threat) if Jonas was anywhere near his general level at the moment, but he wasn't. Also, while 4 minutes is a huge amount of time to recover there was still the possibility after that of Pog properly cracking somewhere, it's happened before and degrading him is what they've been trying. This is currently the tightest GC between them since '22, so we've seen bigger gaps.

I think it's unfair to say the tactic was poorly executed other than that - they've isolated him pretty easily on several stages, but he's not shown any real weakness so far (yesterday was close, would have loved to see him with another couple of climbs in his legs and Jonas going for the time not the stage...). But you can isolate him and then you've got to have the legs to dispatch him, and Jonas hasn't had that.

As for the rest of the team being too fatigued to drop Pog (@DeadCalm's point you were replying to), they've never been trying to drop Pog, they've been trying to drop UAE teammates, and they've succeeded almost every time they've tried. After that it's all up to Jonas.

I honestly don't see that much they could have done different, other than the Hautacam stage. Maybe not bring Wout in the first place, who's looked cooked by the Giro. Vingegaard is the only rider in the world that has a chance of dropping Pog, and he needs to be flying and Pog on a bad that for that to happen. They've tried to engineer that all race and yes, they're knackered as well, that's the price. The fact that Pog's ridden conservatively, has turned up his nose at potential stage wins and is showing signs of a lot of fatigue now suggests they've done alright without being able to finish the job. Meanwhile a load of people who've claimed they don't understand Visma's tactics (despite being the same strat they've employed before) are all asking "what's up with Pog, does he have a cold, is he ill and hiding it?" while Pog's standing there saying "I wanna get this over and go home, it's been a tough Tour with people attacking me from all sides". I mean he's literally telling them directly why he's knackered and moody and not enjoying it, but there must be some mystery illness or something because there's no other reason they can see...

Sorry @mididoctors, not ranting at you, you've been pretty good in analysis all race and we've had a disagreement or two but that's just discussion, just using you as a springboard for a rant.

Sorry everyone else for the rant and wall of text. I know I'll get written-off as a one-eyed fan-boi but if you've you've got genuine tactical ideas for what Visma should have done instead of magical thinking like "he should have tried to attack further out" then I'll happily discuss. Visma are the only team that have tried to take it to Pogacar - the only team that could - and the pointing and laughing style of post is deeply uncharitable, to put it charitably.

Also, part of me ranting a bit is getting wound up by commentary elsewhere, which is much, much worse than even the worst posts on here (e.g. Belgian commentary team literally calling Jonas a pant-shïtter yesterday and the crap he took because of it). Nobody's fault here but it's already got me a little defensive.

But I'll leave this with Jorgenson's brother on BlueSky:

View attachment 781483

I've been agreeing with everything you posted. I only also think Pog is sick.

 

[M.R.M]

Lol FvdB ?????

Got second. Was the best possible result for him and invaluable for the team. He can't just ride with 2 faster sprinters to the line and not do anything. His only mistake was not calling Stewart "Remco". Then Stewart would have dragged him to the line regardless the distance. Trentin and Viviani should have told him. 😉

 

[No Ta Doctor]

Maybe. I think after watching him Friday he’s not up to it. At this stage I would wonder whether he will even make the Vuelta.

"Congratulations, good race. Sorry if we've been a bit rough with you, see you in the Vuelta"

"

 

[N0bodyOfTheGoat]

I've been agreeing with everything you posted. I only also think Pog is sick.

He has looked rough as a dog on the podium presentations for at least two days.

 

[No Ta Doctor]

People may be expecting to much from tomorrow. Yes, it’s got the nasty climb but by time they’ve done the processional start it’s going to be a very short stage so won’t be like the Olympic road race was. They may lose the pure sprinters but I still think it will be a fairly big bunch sprinting for the stage win.

I think my main expectation is that it's going to be very stressed and that people are quite likely to get hurt in the fight for position. It's not the climb in itself that's going to be problematic, it's the narrow roads and everyone wanting to be at the front

 

[No Ta Doctor]

 

[mididoctors]

Yellow Jersey win in Paris tomorrow? , will he go for it ?

Nah

 

[mididoctors]

I guess we will know after the tour if he was ill .

 

[mididoctors]

I think.he and most of the GC crowd were utterly exhausted.... There's was no days off this tour ....race was on most days demanding focus . It must be a fast tour with all the tail wind