Transcript of my call with an Indian Microsoft Support scammer.

[DaveReading]

I have thought about the issues you raise and have never been rude to the callers who I believe may even be unaware that they are part of a scam.

That's probably true to a certain extent, in that the scammers obviously don't hire people by teling them they are going to be doing something illegal.

But anyone with half a brain must realise, by the time they have been in the job for a few days, that they are participating in a scam - if only because they will have been told that by some of their more clued-up targets. A BBC programme a few months ago backed that up in an interview with a former member of one of the teams.

I wouldn't blame anyone for being rude to someone who is knowingly out to defraud them. I don't personally, though I've been gratuitously sworn at myself by some of the scammers. Instead, I like to try to keep them on the line for as long as possible, on the principle that while they are talking to me they can't be conning some other poor unsuspecting victim.

Having recently got one of those phones that automatically switch withheld and international numbers to the ansaphone, I'm actually starting to miss my chats with the scammers, who for some reason never seem to leave a message.

 

[Andrew_Culture]

Not a scam, but I thought I'd share a call I keep getting from VirginMedia (I'm a customer). After a short exchange of pleasantries with the caller in which I am asked to confirm my own address (hey, you called me!) I am offered a new phone deal whereby for £7.50 a month I can get free weekend and evening calls. Every time I receive this phone call I ask how much my record of billing shows me spending on phonecalls over the last few years. 'Nothing' comes the reply. 'Well it doesn't sound like a very exciting deal' I say each time. To which the operator agrees it does not and we part ways as perhaps not as friends, but certainly not as advesaries.

 

[hoopdriver]

Errr..naive how? Probably the callers are the naive ones. They are told to follow a script when someone answers to get them to buy 'the product'. Like the one milllion UK residents with a similar job except without the benefit of a Welfare state as a safety net. You may find that morals are harder to maintain when faced with a family to feed. Yes, we know it's a scam, they might know it's a scam, I prefer not to assume it's the caller themselves that is responsible for the call and appeal to their humanity before hanging up, no harm done with my method or yours.

A million people in the UK with similar jobs? Even I do not have so dour an outlook as to believe one million UK residents are engaged in outright criminality (wire fraud) at call centres.

 

[mr_cellophane]

the only thing that does is confirm your email address is valid making it more valuable to see to send you more phishing emails...

How does that work then ?
The link is only a standard URL with nothing that could link a reply to my email and the email I put in their web page is the one the bank uses for reporting phishing emails.

 

[IDMark2]

I suppose my figure might be flawed in that they are not engaged in fraud, as you say. What they are doing is trying to sell you something.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...the-dark-side-of-the-call-centre-8654571.html

'With more than 1 million people estimated to work in outbound contact centres – those that cold-call people – the total number of unsolicited calls made in the UK this year could top two billion. In fact, according to contact centre industry analyst ContactBabel, there are 5,675 call centres in the UK employing 1,125,000 people. That means 3.99 per cent of all workers are now employed at call centres.'

 

[Davidc]

People trying to sell me something just get told to go away. If they persist I use the please hold on while I turn the cooker off routine. People trying to defraud or scam me get whatever nasty response I can summon up.

The Microsoft one, which I've had a couple of times got the "I use Linux" routine the first time and a lot of time wasted by a bored me taking the p*s* the second time.

 

[hoopdriver]

I suppose my figure might be flawed in that they are not engaged in fraud, as you say. What they are doing is trying to sell you something.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...the-dark-side-of-the-call-centre-8654571.html

'With more than 1 million people estimated to work in outbound contact centres – those that cold-call people – the total number of unsolicited calls made in the UK this year could top two billion. In fact, according to contact centre industry analyst ContactBabel, there are 5,675 call centres in the UK employing 1,125,000 people. That means 3.99 per cent of all workers are now employed at call centres.'

Fine. But you cannot equate in any meaningful sense the million people who are employing (exploited) in a legitimate activity like telephone sales and those who are commiting wire fraud - and let's be realistic here, nobody who calls up a stranger purporting to represent Microsoft when they know they are not, and telling the mug at the other end of the line that their computer is sending out error messages, when they know this is not the case, and seeking to gain control of that person's computer for the purposes of forcing a sale of software and downloading whatever other malware that have in hand, can possibly imagine that they are doing anything legitimate. They know damn well they are committing fraud.

 

[Julia9054]

I worked in a call centre when my boys were babies. I'd do a couple of 7 - midnight shifts a week. We were receiving calls rather than cold calling people though - credit card help desk of a major high street bank.
There were some very diverse and interesting characters there. Memorable ones include

• Woman who had 3 year old twins. She used to work 2 full consecutive night shifts which meant as the was looking after the twins in the day, she was basically awake over 50 hours straight. She used to lie on the floor fast asleep in a sleeping bag with her headset on and when a call came in, she would be wide awake and at her computer screen inside a couple of rings.
• Man whose life was general knowledge quizzes and competitions. He spent his time cramming his head with facts between calls convinced that one day, he was going to win a fortune.
• Woman studying for an OU physics degree in secret as her husband didn't believe his wife should be more educated than him

I read Charles Darwin's Origin of Species between calls to keep my brain alive!

 

[IDMark2]

...and seeking to gain control of that person's computer for the purposes of forcing a sale of software .

This, I think, where our misunderstandings of each others viewpoint is.

My understanding of the typical scam call is that the agent purports to be from a company which is a Microsoft Partner. They then, guided by a script, aim to get you to a page on your computer screen, which to the uninitiated and vulnerable will look very scary because it is a list of unintelligible filenames and some will have an error icon against them. But you got them here so far, they didn't control your computer, heck, they didn't even know if you have a computer. You did it. Now, guided by that same script, they will then try to sell you a bit of software to 'mend' it.

Now, it would be illegal and fraudulent to gain access to your computer but they don't. You do it and you tell them what you see. And they're just workers, humans, in call centres.

The only difference we have is 'Do they know they are doing something which is morally wrong, and do they care about it'. I just ask them that. Honest like.

 

[hoopdriver]

This, I think, where our misunderstandings of each others viewpoint is.

My understanding of the typical scam call is that the agent purports to be from a company which is a Microsoft Partner. They then, guided by a script, aim to get you to a page on your computer screen, which to the uninitiated and vulnerable will look very scary because it is a list of unintelligible filenames and some will have an error icon against them. But you got them here so far, they didn't control your computer, heck, they didn't even know if you have a computer. You did it. Now, guided by that same script, they will then try to sell you a bit of software to 'mend' it.

Now, it would be illegal and fraudulent to gain access to your computer but they don't. You do it and you tell them what you see. And they're just workers, humans, in call centres.

The only difference we have is 'Do they know they are doing something which is morally wrong, and do they care about it'. I just ask them that. Honest like.

Well, I don't get them anywhere, let alone to my computer. But to blame the receiver of the call for following the scripted instructions of the caller - admittedly a dumb thing to do - is to blame the victim. And as for control of your computer, that is very much on the agenda with the scammers requesting that you download something that will allow them to 'help' you. So yes, they do try to gain access to your computer.

 

[mr_cellophane]

Last time I had someone from Windows call me they wanted me to download a remote control app. They also tried to convince me that they couldn't do anything underhand as I would see exactly what they were doing on the screen.
I think I lasted half an hour on one until I told him I didn't have a Start button. I always answer the opening remark with "Which computer are you talking about ?" I have 6 or 7 on at any one time. They usually just repeat the opening until one of us gets fed up with that and moves on.

 

[Jon George]

My favourite response - "I charge £25.00 to take unsolicited calls. Who shall I bill this one to?"

Any charge for nicking this to add to my repertoire?

 

[andytheflyer]

There's almost always a pause after you pick the phone up. That gives their game away. I wait for them to introduce themselves, then put the phone down without saying anything.

I was once abusive down the phone to a Brit who cold called, and he plagued me for several days by ringing back and being abusive. Unfortunately his number was withheld so I could not take it further. But I was pleased to waste his time.

 

[Jon George]

As a connoisseur of the opening answer-phone message to The Rockford Files, I delighted in the episode with the automated cold call machine leaving a long, silent message on Jim's, after announcing it would wait for him to answer. I achieved something near to this only yesterday - a message about Solar Panels left on my BT 1571 service - which was promptly deleted. (But not before a laugh and trip down memory lane.)

 

[Andrew_Culture]

I used to really enjoy answering machine messages, one of my favourites was playing the bit in 'Oh Superman' by Lori Anderson, followed by the remaining many minutes for the track.

Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh Hoh

As I believe the lyrics are.