With new cab designs and lots of mirrors, radar and cameras coming onto the market, it will certainly be a lot safer than it was, but it's highly unlikely that these logging trucks will be up to date.
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DRHysted
Guru
- Location
- New Forest
I have experience of Scottish logging lorries, they are interesting road users!!
Interestingly we are starting to see a few lorries at work with cameras instead of mirrors, they seem to cause the drivers hellish problems reversing onto our loading ramps.
DRM
Guru
- Location
- West Yorks
Mercedes Actros, first time I saw one I wondered where the hell the mirrors were, I’m guessing these logging trucks are on the same set up as tippers further south, ie on bonus, more loads equals more pay, equals appalling bullying driving.
steveindenmark
Legendary Member
I have had my class 1 licence for over 40 years and the diagram you have knocked up makes no sense at all. Trikes are more visible on the road as they take up more space. If you ever get to ride one on a road, you will see how much more room you are given. If you are sitting in the cab of a lorry. For something not to be visible in front of you., it would almost have to be laying under your bumper.
IMO there's nothing wrong with the diagram apart from being extremely crude and slipshod and not at all to scale.
It is wholly inarguable that something lower to the ground will be in the blind spot at a farther distance from the front of the cab - trigonometry exists. Whether this extended "cone of invisibility" contributes to lower safety outcomes is neither proven nor disproven, because as recumbents are vanishingly rare, any collisions involving them would heavily skew any analyses that compare them against the cyclist population in general.
Now, I'm not a truck driver, nor could I ever get a licence to be one for medical reasons, so I will defer to your expertise on this matter. I'm certainly not going to lie down in front of a truck and see how close it gets before I can stop looking into the driver's eyes.
I'm aware of these types of photos but that's not really the principle I'm arguing.
I'd love to see a similar image that visualises the blindspots as the 3d volumes they are, rather than a "none of these people are visible" 2d slice.
steveindenmark
Legendary Member
Blind spots to the sides I will accept.
The driver in this example can see all the people in front of him. It is actually a poor example. If the cab had been higher he would still see them all but probably only the heads of the front row.
But how would they mystically appear that close in front of him without him seeing them?
A trike is far easier to see than a bike. I used to tell people that mine almost had the footprint of a mini. The biggest danger with mine was people driving so slowly in front of me to watch me in their mirrors or have the kids glare at me out of the back window.
The driver in this example can see all the people in front of him. It is actually a poor example. If the cab had been higher he would still see them all but probably only the heads of the front row.
But how would they mystically appear that close in front of him without him seeing them?
A trike is far easier to see than a bike. I used to tell people that mine almost had the footprint of a mini. The biggest danger with mine was people driving so slowly in front of me to watch me in their mirrors or have the kids glare at me out of the back window.
I have cameras fitted to my scania, it's a retro fit. There's five cameras but I still have mirrors. Their really more for recording accidents than help you see.
Only the left hand one is any use. It's mounted on the front of the wheel arch, looking back. When you indicate left the monitor in the cab just shows that one camera image, normally it shows all five. Strangely when you're reversing all five go blank.
byegad
Legendary Member
- Location
- NE England
This^.
As a recumbent trike rider I get much more room than a 'normal bike'.
I'm getting a little sick of being told I can't be seen by people who have no experience of using one on the roads, yet are seemingly perfectly capable of seeing lines painted on the road.
I appear to have unwittingly wandered into the recumbent section from the sidebar. I was merely giving my opinion on an extremely sketchy stretch of road and a demonstration of trigonometry.
I didn't realise that this was contested territory like the helmet threads... time for me to hit the ol' dusty trail...
*backs away, carefully*
*runs*
. o O ( Don't look back, Ed, the chaise longues are after you )
I didn't realise that this was contested territory like the helmet threads... time for me to hit the ol' dusty trail...
*backs away, carefully*
*runs*
. o O ( Don't look back, Ed, the chaise longues are after you )
Bad Machine
In the garage .....
- Location
- East Anglia
Another "demonstration of trigonometry" to discuss ?
The difference in height is only relevant when the lorry is right behind the recumbent.
Maybe the concern an attentive lorry driver has, that this "peculiar" cyclist disappears when really close to the cab, explains why the majority of us who trike see wider and longer passes ?
But then again, if you've never ridden one, how would you know that happens ?
The difference in height is only relevant when the lorry is right behind the recumbent.
Maybe the concern an attentive lorry driver has, that this "peculiar" cyclist disappears when really close to the cab, explains why the majority of us who trike see wider and longer passes ?
But then again, if you've never ridden one, how would you know that happens ?
OP
OP
oldwheels
Legendary Member
- Location
- Isle of Mull
Have you ever cycled on the A82 recently? On the Corran/Fort William stretch particularly it is verging on suicidal.
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OP
OP
oldwheels
Legendary Member
- Location
- Isle of Mull
Part of the problem is driver frustration. It is 8 miles Ft William to Corran Ferry and with lots of bends and poor forward visiblity as well as heavy oncoming traffic opportunities to overtake are few on this narrow road. There were so many fatalities that a speed limit of 50mph was introduced. Eight miles behind relatively slow trike can lead to bad decisions.
I ride a trike myself as well as drive so I have some insight.
Ming the Merciless
There is no mercy
- Location
- Inside my skull
The velomobile will be doing around 30 mph along that stretch
OP
OP
oldwheels
Legendary Member
- Location
- Isle of Mull
? ? If motorised should be limited to 15mph surely.
Bad Machine
In the garage .....
- Location
- East Anglia
15.5 mph is the speed limit to which a legal motor-assist can power you * - but there's nothing to stop you going faster, but you'll just be using your own leg power.
*you can modify many of the electric motor systems to provide electric assist to a higher speed - but that's a mod that produces something other than a road-legal e-bike/pedelec.
