Vango Spirit 200 + (plus) tent pole breakage?

[Blue Hills]

I bought one of these tents fairly recently - very pleased with ease of putting it up/down and general design, but a problem.

Apart from a bit of test use in my sheltered garden, it's only been erected on camp for a total of 5 or 6 days, a total of 3 pitchings, - always well sheltered in ideal conditions.

But a pole has just broken (the "orange-coded" one) for what I can see as no good reason - I am pretty sure I ensured that the pole sections were always properly slotted together and this impression is supported by the nature of the metal shape which sheared off.

I called Vango - they gave me what I now believe is their standard initial response (I didn't know this when I bought it) about poles not being covered by any guarantee (!!) but faced with my outrage at a breakage after such light use they have said that they will send me a spare bit of pole (not a full new one) to fix it.

So far so good but I'm concerned that this may not be a "freak" and that I may have future breakages when I'm not so close to home.

I'm no engineer but I do also wonder about the wisdom of the "gothic arch" pattern to the poles which means that they are not a perfect curve.

Anyone else got this tent/got any feedback/advice?

PS - I don't usually use the extra inside tensioning cord but I asked about this when I got the tent - Vango told me that they were optional/only for use in windy conditions. And it's never been windy.

 

[SatNavSaysStraightOn]

I've never managed to break any of this type poles (and we did have this tent for a while). But I have found if you look carefully that the poles are not perfectly straight and I always line all of the sections up into a natural curve before I put them into the tent sleeve, making sure that the pole goes in with the curve as needed (not sure how to explain that). Ironically with that tent, I always applied the tensioning cord inside...

We've just finished a 12 month camping tour in a Hilleberg Nammatj 3GT (after 2 week tour in the Vango Spirit 200+ we quickly realised it was not up to what we needed). But I have heard of plenty of people breaking poles (less so on the Hillebergs but still know of at least 1).

Not sure why, but I suspect that not lining them up, and knocking the ends of each section in and out rather than placing them in and carefully pullling them apart probably has a lot to do with it. I cringe when I see people just flick the pole into a straight line letting tension pull it together - those ends are more fragile than they look and can chip quite easily.

 

[vernon]

I have had a section of a Vango pole fracture and then break off. To be fair the tent had had three or four seasons' worth of use by school kids and will probably have been abused. I managed to cope by using the emergency repair section and gaffer tape until I got home.

I rang Vango and found that the tent was out of production and that the pole diameter was no longer a standard spare. The chap that I dealt with was very good and ordered a replacement for me and wouldn't hear of me making a payment for the section.

When the package arrived it contained enough sections to make a complete pole.

 

[Crankarm]

Vango are normally very good to deal with and send bits out foc. Alternatively you could buy a generic pole kit and repair the section of pole yourself. It is not hard. Just get the correct diameter, cut pole to length and then insert shock cord. Simples.

 

[Blue Hills]

Thanks for the replies.

Satnavsaysstraighton: I'me a bit puzzled by your description.

What do you mean by: "if you look carefully that the poles are not perfectly straight"?

I know that they aren't at the "gothic arch" bit but don't understand what you might mean apart from that.

Am also puzzled by: "I always line all of the sections up into a natural curve before I put them into the tent sleeve".

Isn't it the curved sleeve that makes the inserted pole curve?

"applied the tensioning cord inside" - can you explain this? I don't understand. Sorry if I'm being thick.

"Vango Spirit 200+ we quickly realised it was not up to what we needed" - can I ask what the problem was?

Any advice on the pole insertion bit of the procedure in particular appreciated - I gather that it's key. I always take care to not PULL the poles through at any point as I know that this can pull the sections apart.

 

[SatNavSaysStraightOn]

Thanks for the replies.
Satnavsaysstraighton: I'me a bit puzzled by your description.
What do you mean by: "if you look carefully that the poles are not perfectly straight"?
I know that they aren't at the "gothic arch" bit but don't understand what you might mean apart from that.
Am also puzzled by: "I always line all of the sections up into a natural curve before I put them into the tent sleeve".
Isn't it the curved sleeve that makes the inserted pole curve?
"applied the tensioning cord inside" - can you explain this? I don't understand. Sorry if I'm being thick.
"Vango Spirit 200+ we quickly realised it was not up to what we needed" - can I ask what the problem was?
Any advice on the pole insertion bit of the procedure in particular appreciated - I gather that it's key. I always take care to not PULL the poles through at any point as I know that this can pull the sections apart.

With our tent, when the poles were extended, we found that they were not exactly straight. Some of the sections had a very slight curve to them. We lined those curves up so they all matched. - in other words, each section of each pole is designed to bend but usually only in one direction. If you are not careful/just plain unlucky, the pole with resemble more of an S shape rather than a C shape when inserted. If the S shape does not resolve itself to a C shape during insertion into the pole sleeve, one section of the pole will be orientated the wrong way and be under more strain than it should be.

It is not entirely the curved sleeve that causes the bend of the poles.
As for the tensioning cord - we always used it - it was the Q you said you answered no to when speaking with Vango. It puts more strain on the poles pulling them into a tighter C shape.

Why the Vango Spirit 200+ was not suitable is a whole load of another issue. I have written a review on the tent we replaced it with the Hilleberg Nammatj 3 GT, which is basically the swedish version of the next size up with extension and that description does not do the Hilleberg any justice whatsoever. I have camped all my life in Vango's. Usually the Force Ten mk IV models, think big orange A frame tent. We also had various other lightweight Vangos for hiking. I love them, but the Spirit 200+ was not up to what we needed. We went off on a long camping cycle tour and there was just so much about the Spirit 200+ that did not meet the needs of living out of it for what was planned to be more than 3-4 years, but in the end was only 12 months. Ventialtion, midge protection, height, ease of putting up - the nammatj can use any pole in any sleeve - more useful for putting up in the dark, just to name a few.

 

[Blue Hills]

Thanks for the wonderful reply satnav' - I'll definitely take a closer look at the poles and their inherent curve.

Pedantry: by "tensioning cord" which I've never really used, I meant the string affair running from the pocket in the apex of the porch - is that what you meant and did use? And as you implied, increased strain on the poles?

ie: I did NOT mean the three tensioning cords that run across the tent between the ends of the 3 poles. I find Vango's advice to not over-tighten these a bit bizarre since, if they manufacture the thing consistently, surely there is a manufactured-in limit on how far they can be tightened?

Just read your sign-off line by the way - get well soon.

 

[SatNavSaysStraightOn]

If I remember correctly, the tensioning cord is actually the bit that forms that 'triangle' inside the tent. not sure if it has been redesigned. we had the 2009 season tent I think - possibly the 2010 tent when we had it. but it is the one with the clips. Pulled too tightly they pull the tent out of its natural shape and more into a rounded off square (if it were taken to its extreme and its the only way I can think of explaining it in words) rather than the inverted U the tent is meant to form. They are there for windy conditions, for when the wind is hitting the tent side on to brace the U from shifting sideays too much into a U shape which has a greater strain on the pole in what is the bottom lefthand corner of the letter as you see it in print.

The ones that run from the bottom of each pole to the bottom of the same pole (hope that makes sense) are to hold the tent into the U shape to allow the inner tent to go it, amongst other things. With both our Spirit 200+ and the Hilleberg, we often found the need to remove the inner tent first - if only to dry it out from the humidity/condesation issues these tents inherently have when 2 people are in them. If these 3 bottom straps are not the correct length, you will find it surprisingly difficult to get the inner tent back in - the ground edges will simply be too far apart to clip the tent back in - and similarly with the footprint you will find that it also won't fit. One of the problems we found with the Hilleberg (we only ever used the Spirit 200+ for 2 weeks) was that overtime, the knots holding these across straps in place, slacken off and you have to re-tighten them becuase they then slip. Pull them too tight and you put too much tension into the poles. It is a finely balanced game!

thanks for the best wishes. the leg is getting better slowly, very slowly... but I can now manage around 18 miles on my bike again - at least on the turbo trainer. Outside I am still limiting it to 12 miles so I know I can get home without a rescue party!

 

[Blue Hills]

Thanks for that, I now feel a bit better about the tent and its idiosyncrasies, which you've analysed very well.

 

[Maudso]

Just to add my 2p to this, I have the 200+ & have been using it for the last 10 months on a cycle tour. Well, not in the last 2 months as been in cheap hotels, but extensively before then. Have had no issues at all with it & absolutely love it! Fits my needs perfectly (just me in the tent - don't think it would be suitable for 2 people over a long period of time).

I would add that I think the footprint is essential on those rainy evenings when your cooking in the porch area.

EDIT: Just to add, I saw the pics of your dog bite on CGOAB when it happened. I was due to cycle through Turkey shortly after & got me scared! I was lucky though Hope your all better soon & can carry on!

 

[SatNavSaysStraightOn]

Just to add my 2p to this, I have the 200+ & have been using it for the last 10 months on a cycle tour. Well, not in the last 2 months as been in cheap hotels, but extensively before then. Have had no issues at all with it & absolutely love it! Fits my needs perfectly (just me in the tent - don't think it would be suitable for 2 people over a long period of time).

I would add that I think the footprint is essential on those rainy evenings when your cooking in the porch area.

EDIT: Just to add, I saw the pics of your dog bite on CGOAB when it happened. I was due to cycle through Turkey shortly after & got me scared! I was lucky though Hope your all better soon & can carry on!

I think part of the issues with it were that we are 2 people and one is 6 foot. also lacking the midge/mossie nets that the hilleberg nammatj has and us going through scandinavia made us change it after 2 weeks of it in Denmark the year before.

So where are you now? We would have been in China if we had been able to continue... Glad you got through Turkey OK... just been out for another ride - its not without issues but I can manage just over an hour now, if there's an hours physio done the night before!

 

[Blue Hills]

Thanks for the feedback Maudso.

Two new pole sections have arrived FOC from Vango (8.55mm x 55cm) - they said they would send instructions but I guess it's pretty straightforward.

I do love the tent - I don't have the footprint for inner or outer - I use a tarp costing £5 or so from B&Q and think I prefer this. Just roll it up, fasten it on the rack with the rest of the gubbins. It covers the inside of the tent and then a foot or two into the outer, giving me something to step onto - I prefer leaving the rest as grass - more footprint would just be more for me to cack up I think. It feels really luxurious compared to my old Vango dome tent - wonderful to lie in the inner with the two doors open having a cuppa. On advice from a fellow camper I've taken to leaving the inner door open at night to reduce condensation - may change this in colder weather.

I'm old-fashioned/uber careful on the question of porch cooking - can't see myself doing it. As it is, I always cook some distance from the tent. If it's wet I think I'll just eat cold stuff/quickly boil water outside for couscous before chucking usual tinned fish on.

Thanks again chaps - I too looked at those bite photos - nasty but a nice story about the help received.

After a bit more use I'll try to add some more comments to this thread if I have any.

 

[Maudso]

I think part of the issues with it were that we are 2 people and one is 6 foot. also lacking the midge/mossie nets that the hilleberg nammatj has and us going through scandinavia made us change it after 2 weeks of it in Denmark the year before.

So where are you now? We would have been in China if we had been able to continue... Glad you got through Turkey OK... just been out for another ride - its not without issues but I can manage just over an hour now, if there's an hours physio done the night before!

Thread hijack!

Am in Japan now - flew from Turkey to India (didn't want to hassles with the Iran/Pakistan route), & then flew from India to South Korea (couldn't get a Chinese visa from India). Hence the reason for not using the tent for the last 2 months - hotels so cheap in India & South Korea. When you get back on the road, I highly recommend South Korea - beautiful country. Japan too, but bloody expensive here.

Back to the tent... For cooking in the tent porch - it has very good ventilation so no problem at all! I have had many an evening where it was just too wet to go outside & sat there cooking quite happily

 

[Blue Hills]

Update, not a nice one I'm afraid.
Sorted the rear pole problem by cutting the new section to length with a Dremel and then smoothing (is it advisable to take a hacksaw on camp?) the end. Went on another trip of what was meant to be four nights. Erected in perfect weather conditions in a single spot on a campsite - it's never been free-camping. On the morning after the third night there was a crack from the front of the tent - pole sheared and the sharp razor then created cut through the sleeve. Only way to then get the stuck pole out was to remove the shock cord (it would be helpful if info on how to do this was in the tent instructions) and take the pole out in bits.

Using the tent for the last night didn't seem like a good idea as it seemed to me that even using the metal repair sleeve and strong tape I had deliberately brought, the pole sleeve would get damaged further and the tent would start to tear itself apart. So abandoned the camp - farmer/camspite owner refunded my last night's money and was as mystified as me - weather calm all the time I and my tent (described as "lightweight, reliable, robust" by Vango) had been there.
.
I couldn't possibly have taken more care putting the tent up - anyone who had watched me would have thought I was manufacturing the thing - poles all pushes through as recommended and I even carefully examined all of the pole sections for signs of wear. Cords not overtightened at all. After all the poles were in and the tent was up I virtually caressed the pole sleeves to check that all sections inside were perfectly joined.

So apart from a test pitch before each trip, the tent has been erected 4 times for 9 nights only. Unfit for purpose is the only conclusion it seems to me. Retail price of ths tent is currently £300.

It is now in no state to use.

I have been in touch with outdoorworlddirect and Vango - currently hopeful that this will be sorted on the basis that there was something wrong with the manufacture of the particular tent I bought. This would be kind of supported by the fact that whoever put the thing together hadn't even managed to put the rear pitching buckles on properly - they cannot be used as detailed in the tent's pitching instructions and are simply decorative. If Vango is seeking to claim a weight reduction for a future model they may as well take them off.

Will report back when I learn more.

 

[Blue Hills]

Update

Tent returned from Vango - I got them to accelerate their normal process of what I gather is about 5 weeks for "special circumstances"

Tent has been repaired. You can see where they've done it but functionally it is as good as new.

They also sorted the pole and in addition, to my surprise, sent a spare "gothic arch" small section and on further examination I realised that the angle and dimensions of that are the same on all three poles. So that was good of them. Although that wasn't the bit that went on mine and I don't really expect it to - in both instances it was the sleeve of the join that went rather than the ferrule and the gothic arch bit has a ferrule either side. Might be an idea for owners of the tent (and similar ones) to secure a spare of this bit as while you can repair other broken poles with the repair sleeve and some duct tape, or even cut new pole section to length and insert that, I'm not sure what you could do if this bit were to go.

The tent was just outside it's "guarantee" but I sent them a full and very detailed and true pitching history. They sorted it free of charge as a "gesture of goodwill" - I suppose in case there's any legal comeback from them establishing the expectation that a tent will outlast 10 nights/protect themselves from piss-takers..

Oh the apparently mis-threaded rear-of-tent tensioning buckles were apparently on the rght way round - clearly you are meant to peg the loop formed by the buckle rather than what seems to be the natural bit to peg/formed as if to take a peg. Doing it their way though may twist the strap a bit (amongst many cautions they warn you not to twist anything) and actually be as much of a faff as my previous system. Not much in it,

So the tent is now really good as new.

My only question now I suppose is whether that is good enough - after my experience I do have certain concerns/worries about the tent. I'm not altogether convinced by it's design/execution.

After it went away and I was unsure what was going to happen I did get another tent (!) and although I haven't yet camped in it, it was half the list price and half the actual purchase price and I can't help feeling that it's probably effectively just as good, maybe better.