VAR - good or bad for the game?

[SpokeyDokey]

I agree whole heatedly with the bits I've bolded.

But the position re offside is surely ridiculous?
The purpose off the offside rule, as introduced, was to stop "goal hanging", not to penalise someone for having a toenail beyond the last defender on the halfway line!

There are similar issues wrt accidental handball by defender and attacker being treated differently - not directly VAR but made worse.

In which case the rule needs changing which is obviously nothing to do with VAR per se.

Re toenail - I know where you are coming from but there needs to be a cut off point somewhere.

 

[gavgav]

How on earth has that penalty been given for Watford, by VAR? It’s never a penalty in a million years. The ball was heading out of play and the delayed reaction from the player was pathetic. Football needs to go and see how it works for Rugby, where communication can be heard, the TMO and on field officials work together and everyone knows what is happening. Farcical

 

[Bill Gates]

Everyone is assuming that the technology is infallible. It's a video with something like 10 frames a second. With an offside it cannot be definitive to 1 or 2 cm in a fast moving situation. The result is ridiculous decisions are being made. There has to be a degree of error applied. Say within 2 cm either way. Personally I bloody hate it. The only way forward is to allow the referee to have another look at a pitch side monitor. At least the crowd know what's going on

 

[StuAff]

Firmino's strike against Villa was ruled out because his armpit- seriously- was deemed offside.

 

[Dave7]

Firmino's strike against Villa was ruled out because his armpit- seriously- was deemed offside.

Andy Gray (anti Liverpool) stated it was clearly on side. I read one pundit today, publicly accusing Martin Atkinson of cheating by manipulating the graphics. I have to agree with him.

 

[Milkfloat]

Everyone is assuming that the technology is infallible. It's a video with something like 10 frames a second. With an offside it cannot be definitive to 1 or 2 cm in a fast moving situation. The result is ridiculous decisions are being made. There has to be a degree of error applied. Say within 2 cm either way. Personally I bloody hate it. The only way forward is to allow the referee to have another look at a pitch side monitor. At least the crowd know what's going on

Actually the ultra motions cameras are at between 50 and 340 fps depending on the camera.

 

[booze and cake]

In my view its been rubbish so far, there have been issues with VAR every week it seems, and for all the wrong reasons. That Firminio strike should definitely have been a goal, being off by an armpit is ridiculous, if its close they should just say the benefit of the doubt goes to the attacker and leave it at that.

Also in the Spurs game yesterday the VAR ref had to replay about 20 times to check if Alli had hand balled it. If it takes 20 views at a challenge on replay with multiple angles to check if its legit, its obviously not a clear and obvious is it. Get on with the game FFS. I am all for it in principle but its been released before its ready, and its still open to personal interpretation, so is not the magic pill everyone was hoping for. I say back to the drawing board, its causing more issues than its resolving.

 

[Bill Gates]

Actually the ultra motions cameras are at between 50 and 340 fps depending on the camera.

Thanks

Actually the ultra motions cameras are at between 50 and 340 fps depending on the camera.

Thanks for that👍

 

[Bill Gates]

In my view its been rubbish so far, there have been issues with VAR every week it seems, and for all the wrong reasons. That Firminio strike should definitely have been a goal, being off by an armpit is ridiculous, if its close they should just say the benefit of the doubt goes to the attacker and leave it at that.

Also in the Spurs game yesterday the VAR ref had to replay about 20 times to check if Alli had hand balled it. If it takes 20 views at a challenge on replay with multiple angles to check if its legit, its obviously not a clear and obvious is it. Get on with the game FFS. I am all for it in principle but its been released before its ready, and its still open to personal interpretation, so is not the magic pill everyone was hoping for. I say back to the drawing board, its causing more issues than its resolving.

After Son was sent off I turned the TV off. I was going to blow a gasket if I had continued go watch the game. Common sense has gone out of the window

 

[swee'pea99]

After Son was sent off I turned the TV off. I was going to blow a gasket if I had continued go watch the game. Common sense has gone out of the window

The Son red card was perhaps the most ridiculous decision of the season so far, tho' I don't believe VAR was involved.

Alli's handball was surely a handball, however inadvertent. Wasn't there an explicit rule change from the start of this season that contact is enough, period. I'm sure I remember hearing something along those lines.

Interesting that this thread's poll has been pretty much 50/50 throughout.

 

[booze and cake]

@swee'pea99 yes I thought they had explicitly said any handball in the area is a pen, which makes is very strange it was not given straight away. I think the mandatory pen for handball in the area is a ridiculous rule too by the way. In my view it needs to be deliberate, they seemed to have scrapped the 'ball to hand' rule which was a good one. If a striker shoots from 2 yards and it hits a hand of a defender who may have his back to a strike, I think its stupid and unfair to give a pen.

Alli's one yesterday was tricky, his hand was up and not where it should have been, and it hit his hand, so by the letter of the law it should have been a pen. Personally I don't think it was, he was nudged in the air just before impact, which when the player is in the air will have an affect. Alli was also clearly not looking so could not have seen the ball, but most importantly the ball seemed to deflect of Mina's shoulder and then hit Alli's hand from close range, but this was barely detectable, even on replay. When played back in real time there is no way Alli could have avoided the handball, so giving a pen for that seemed harsh.

I think the VAR person also concluded after dozens of replays, it was handball but was not clear and obvious on Alli's part, and would have been harsh to give a pen. So despite being a pen by the letter of the law, the video ref overturned protocol it seemed. It's the lack of common sense and lack of consistency that has always been our beef with referees, and yet despite having VAR we are still having inconsistencies and common sense bypasses. There is a lack of clarity on exactly how they are going to interpret each decision, so instead of clarity we get more muddy waters, and we're still getting individual human based judgement calls, and human error.

 

[Drago]

VAR isn't ruining the game. What's ruining it is overpaid primadonnas laying on the ground pretending to have a broken spine to in order to gain momentary tactical advantage, and 20 seconds later running around perfectly healthy. Its that kind of twittishness that is unsporting, ruins the flow, and detracts from the game. Anyone hurt that bad should be sent off and not allowed to return until they've had a full physical front an independent doctor. Professional football has some very fundamental, long running problems that the games authorities seem reluctant to address, and VAR isn't one of them.

 

[Mark68]

Depends on how you think about it. Examples being the recent RWC in Japan showing dangerous play.
Maybe it could be used in football to highlight the cheating habits of players rolling around on the floor as if something major has happened to them. Sometimes it's just embarrassing watching. Holding their face when the opposing sides player touches their arm. Makes me laugh.
But overall I think it's a good thing.

 

[nickyboy]

Depends on how you think about it. Examples being the recent RWC in Japan showing dangerous play.
Maybe it could be used in football to highlight the cheating habits of players rolling around on the floor as if something major has happened to them. Sometimes it's just embarrassing watching. Holding their face when the opposing sides player touches their arm. Makes me laugh.
But overall I think it's a good thing.

It is a good thing. However we are in a transition period. VAR has shown that there were lots of previously incorrect decisions when you apply the current rules rigorously. But the current rules weren't designed for such intense scrutiny (offside rule, I'm looking at you). So I think we will see a relaxing in the wording of certain rules, which VAR will then rigorously apply.

I think we will see a change in the offside rule, for example to say that both the attacking players feet must be offside. It tips the balance in favour of the attacker which counteracts the intense VAR scrutiny. I'm sure there will be others

 

[Smokin Joe]

Watching Nuremburg v Someone else on BT last night and another three minutes wasted while VAR checked out an obvious offside. It is a crap idea, because the VAR operators will get flamed if the get it wrong so no matter how clear the decision is they will check, check, and check again from every conceivable angle to cover their arses.

It just causes too many hold ups and kills the game.