Was I an Idiot on the road today? (short 40 second video)

[glenn forger]

Would it upset you if drivers did the same thing and just ignored the lights?

Yep, cos one is illegal and the other isn't, so it's a daft comparison.

 

[glenn forger]

Yet to see a cyclist deliberately hit with my own eyes but see a cyclist have to take avoiding action due to a motorist being dumb then blaming the cyclists or taking credit for something that was blatantly not what they did on a daily basis.

Basically I see virtually no evidence for your all your spouting off which imo should be kept in your head so you don't scare half the population off the roads!

Do you know what empirical evidence is? One minute you claim my own experience doesn't count, the next you say yours trumps everything.

 

[themosquitoking]

Yep, cos one is illegal and the other isn't, so it's a daft comparison.

The other should be, which was my original point.

 

[mjr]

Would it upset you if drivers did the same thing and just ignored the lights?

Far too many do already so it wouldn't bother me much. I think car drivers approaching from the other arms of some junctions may object, though!

 

[raleighnut]

Yet to see a cyclist deliberately hit with my own eyes but see a cyclist have to take avoiding action due to a motorist being dumb then blaming the cyclists or taking credit for something that was blatantly not what they did on a daily basis.

Basically I see virtually no evidence for your all your spouting off which imo should be kept in your head so you don't scare half the population off the roads!

Martin the owner of Websters cycles was deliberately knocked off his bike from behind by a car driver as were a few people around Desford in Leicestershire, difference being his attack made the papers. So yes car drivers have been known to drive at cyclists in my certain knowledge.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

Would it upset you if drivers did the same thing and just ignored the lights?

Glenn's right, it's a daft comparison.

Pedestrians have the right to pass and repass over a highway without hindrance; the Pelican lights are there for the instruction of motorists, not pedestrians.
If you tried to enact an obligation to wait at red for peds you'd succeed in convincing even more people to cross where there isn't one.

GC

 

[themosquitoking]

Glenn's right, it's a daft comparison.

Pedestrians have the right to pass and repass over a highway without hindrance; the Pelican lights are there for the instruction of motorists, not pedestrians.
If you tried to enact an obligation to wait at red for peds you'd succeed in convincing even more people to cross where there isn't one.

GC

In my world you would only be obliged to wait for the red if you have requested it. Why do you think it's ok to request a red light and then just cross the road before it, you could be holding up 10, 15, 20 people at the red light you requested and there is no one there to cross? Even forgetting about the extra delay you've caused them going about their day think of the extra fuel you're causing them to burn by having to brake for a red light that wasn't needed and then get back up to speed.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

In my world you would only be obliged to wait for the red if you have requested it. Why do you think it's ok to request a red light and then just cross the road before it, you could be holding up 10, 15, 20 people at the red light you requested and there is no one there to cross? Even forgetting about the extra delay you've caused them going about their day think of the extra fuel you're causing them to burn by having to brake for a red light that wasn't needed and then get back up to speed.

There are two scenarios:

Yours
Ped pushes button at lights to stop traffic.
Delay allows all traffic to pass before changing to red.
Ped waits dutifully for green man.
Lights change to red for cars.
A couple of cars arrive and stop.
Ped crosses road.
After ten seconds the lights change back to green and traffic continues.

Mine
Ped pushes button at lights to stop traffic.
Delay allows all traffic to pass before changing to red.
Ped crosses before green man because the road is clear.
Lights change to red for cars.
A couple of cars arrive and stop.
After ten seconds the lights change back to green and traffic continues.

The time from green to red to green again is the same in both cases, the only difference is that my drivers don't get to see the ped. There is no extra delay caused nor extra fuel burned and, best of all, my ped doesn't miss his train.


GC

 

[themosquitoking]

There are two scenarios:

Yours
Ped pushes button at lights to stop traffic.
Delay allows all traffic to pass before changing to red.
Ped waits dutifully for green man.
Lights change to red for cars.
A couple of cars arrive and stop.
Ped crosses road.
After ten seconds the lights change back to green and traffic continues.

Mine
Ped pushes button at lights to stop traffic.
Delay allows all traffic to pass before changing to red.
Ped crosses before green man because the road is clear.
Lights change to red for cars.
A couple of cars arrive and stop.
After ten seconds the lights change back to green and traffic continues.

The time from green to red to green again is the same in both cases, the only difference is that my drivers don't get to see the ped. There is no extra delay caused nor extra fuel burned and, best of all, my ped doesn't miss his train.


GC

Or scenario 3. Ped gets to crossing, looks at traffic situation before pressing button. Realises there is no need to press button and no extra time or fuel is used up by anyone.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

Or scenario 3. Ped gets to crossing, looks at traffic situation before pressing button. Realises there is no need to press button and no extra time or fuel is used up by anyone.

I don't think anyone has a problem with that one, although it's not the one that you posed. I was addressing the illogical scenario you envisaged in your world, the one where the ped ought to wait for the red light he requested. It makes no difference whether he waits or not, except for maybe annoying the odd driver.

GC

 

[mjr]

In my world you would only be obliged to wait for the red if you have requested it. Why do you think it's ok to request a red light and then just cross the road before it, you could be holding up 10, 15, 20 people at the red light you requested and there is no one there to cross? Even forgetting about the extra delay you've caused them going about their day think of the extra fuel you're causing them to burn by having to brake for a red light that wasn't needed and then get back up to speed.

Modern Puffin crossings notice if the requester has already crossed and cancel the request so why not campaign for all old pelicans to be upgraded instead? It'd be much cheaper than hiring loads of crossing button nannies to issue fines.

 

[Dan B]

But it's War On The Motorist

 

[Hip Priest]

The fact that we're even discussing whether pedestrians should be fined for pressing a button suggests that none of us are too busy to wait at a red light for a few seconds.

 

[glenn forger]

In my world you would only be obliged to wait for the red if you have requested it. Why do you think it's ok to request a red light and then just cross the road before it, you could be holding up 10, 15, 20 people at the red light you requested and there is no one there to cross? Even forgetting about the extra delay you've caused them going about their day think of the extra fuel you're causing them to burn by having to brake for a red light that wasn't needed and then get back up to speed.

NSFW FOR MEDIEVAL SWEARS:

http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/f6/7b/2d/f67b2d3a94e293b574dc61f5ae908d93.jpg

Loads of pedestrian crossings have a built in delay. If I press the button and there's a safe gap I will cross, I'm not going to stand there like a lemon waiting for the green man, if drivers are irritated by stopping then they can take it up with whatever clodhoppers installed the lights, or go and boil their heads, I don't care which.

 

[Turbo Rider]

Naaaaah, you did alright mate - she got a bit of a shock but it's better than a bike in the face and some people just don't look properly. If nothing else, she'll look more closely next time, so this near miss might save her life in future and it seems as though you might not make that move next time anyway. Plus the driver might be a bit more cautious about taking the view that he has any jurisdiction in these matters, so it should be a triple high 5 with extra love all round.

As for the button pushing debate...just supposing it were possible to punish these criminals who press buttons (which I do think is a very silly idea, BTW), who the heck is going to police all this?!?! And if CCTV is the answer then are we then expecting peds to wear number plates so they can be identified?!?! There's also this other lovely theory, which holds a certain amount of magic, that lights with buttons near traffic lights change automatically anyway and that all the button push actually does is switch the red man to green (i.e. it doesnt actually stop the traffic at all...like the door close button on a lift)