What hope for cycling?

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Drago

Legendary Member
Yep, until the petrol runs out and we become the mainstream we shall remain the poor relation. Savings for the public purse will always be more important than slaughtering a few innocent cyclists here and there.
 

OneArmedBandit

Active Member
Unfortunately this is just the problem with government in general.

If someone wants to build a £56bn railway MPs will listen to their argument, have a brief discussion and decide to support it

If someone wants to spend £560,000 on cycling infrastructure suddenly that is something that MPs do know about. They've seen people cycling, and it doesn't seem they'd need anything that grand. Honestly there's room to squeeze a white line in between the train line and the tunnel wall, and why spend money tarmacing the path when there will be plenty of leftover shingle?

I just had an argument with a councillor because council contractors had dug up over a kilometre of NCR tarmac cycle path and replaced it with hardcore topped with the tiniest sneeze of fine gravel. She just wouldn't believe this wasn't an acceptable surface for a busy cycle path. Well I say busy, it's not busy any more.
 

OneArmedBandit

Active Member
Surely if a 'right of way' exists then a bridge is mandatory.
Rights of way can be closed. Normally they have to make an alternative provision, but often that alternative seems to be steps down to the nearest dual carriageway. HS2 will do what they want anyway because if an order to stop up the right of way is refused, they will put the railway in regardless.
 

raleighnut

Legendary Member
Rights of way can be closed. Normally they have to make an alternative provision, but often that alternative seems to be steps down to the nearest dual carriageway. HS2 will do what they want anyway because if an order to stop up the right of way is refused, they will put the railway in regardless.
So really it's down to local communities to contest each lost 'crossing point'.
 

OneArmedBandit

Active Member
So really it's down to local communities to contest each lost 'crossing point'.
Thing is they are mostly lost anyway. A bridge tall enough to fit HV electric lines under is four flights of stairs. For many people, especially the elderly, it makes the route unattractive or impossible.

There is one near me which would cut off a loop of my commute home but I tend to take the much longer and busier way via road because it is a massive pain in the bum dragging a bike with panniers up and down. The point I keep making to the council is that it's these invisible barriers that stop people cycling. 90% of the route may be great but if 10% is potholed and covered with stinging nettles that by itself will push people back into cars.
 

Pat "5mph"

A kilogrammicaly challenged woman
Moderator
Location
Glasgow
Trouble is to lobby MP's, councilors, big companies, takes time, lots of time plus one needs to keep informed.
The improving of cycling facilities rests with people that have spare time: when I retire I will certainly do my bit.
 

classic33

Leg End Member
Or keep a visual record of the routes you ride on now. Presenting this as evidence.

The best placed people to gather the evidence required, are those that use them on a regular basis. Checks once or twice a year won't throw up the problems encountered on a daily basis.
 

BromptonChrispy

Well-Known Member
Location
Chester, Earth.
I despair of the future in the UK. Transport policy is laughable. Despite the best efforts of Cycling groups and other interested parties, the Westminster bubble doesn't give a (insert expletive here).
 

Pat "5mph"

A kilogrammicaly challenged woman
Moderator
Location
Glasgow
I saw on my FB feed that a new segregate cycling route to Glasgow Airport has been opened to encourage active travel for the 5000 workforce, that live mainly around a 5 mile radius from the venue.
Astonishing the many comments from people that say it's a waste of money, who would cycle to the airport with their luggage, why not a railway station instead, at least we get them off the roads.
Lots of work to be done to change mentality on cycling as a means of transport.
 

classic33

Leg End Member
We're getting a full width cycle lane, "There'll be enough room to pass another cyclist(Deputy Council Leader), on the footpath on the opposite side of the road.

No provision for getting across the road, four lanes if they finish it. With the majority of the buildings on the same side, and the only shops on that side.

In order to widen the road as planned the pavements are being narrowed.
 

Tizme

Veteran
Location
Somerset
Many, many years ago the A303 was being dualled around our village. This meant the A303 would no longer pass in front of our front door :okay:, however we still protested that no provision was being made for the public footpath that would cross the new road.

The planners stated that they had walked along the path and it appeared "unused and didn't go anywhere" the fact that it led into acres of woods and fields seemed to be irrelevant and how they could claim a well trodden path was unused was completely beyond me! They said there would be "adequate provision made for the few walkers that were likely to use it" when pressed.

The resultant "adequate provision" was a set of steep steps leading down from the new "noise reducing" :rolleyes: cutting directly on to the two lanes going west, a break in the armco barriers in the central reservation and steps and stile on the other side of the two lanes going east. Needless to say we deemed this not safe enough to take our 3 children (all under 6 years old) and 3 dogs for a walk on the footpath any longer.
 
Unfortunately this is just the problem with government in general.
....
I just had an argument with a councillor because council contractors had dug up over a kilometre of NCR tarmac cycle path and replaced it with hardcore topped with the tiniest sneeze of fine gravel. She just wouldn't believe this wasn't an acceptable surface for a busy cycle path. Well I say busy, it's not busy any more.

When your civilisation becomes increasing complex such that no one person can dedicate the mental bandwidth necessary to make seemingly sensible decisions without a whole bunch of negative unintended consequences, you end up with ridiculous outcomes like this. Human's were never meant to live in or solve the problems of mass society. We are left with retrospective, knee jerk reactions and picking up pieces later when it all goes wrong, at great cost compared to how we could have got it right from the outset. Our cognitive power is severely limited, despite our own self-inflated importance and delusions of superior intellect, we are basically chimps, operating on impulse and value judgements, it makes us very prone to getting stuff like this very wrong. The few of us with vested interests in cycling can see the benefits, but those who don't do it, are influenced by their own prejudices, and nefarious lobby groups within the motoring industry.

Because cycling isn't mainstream, it will never warrant the investment and mental bandwidth it truly requires. As @Drago says, it's going to take the end of the age of oil to change things, only the necessity of getting about with only muscle power and biomass energy will mark the end of the motorcar. I fear we passed the point of no return, there can be no "stop de kindermoord" moment in the UK, at least whilst there's the money to do something about it. We're locked in to motor orientated transport. It would take mass civil disobedience to get politicians on board, or a concerted effort to get an under-represented fringe group (yes, the utilitarian cyclists) to be over-represented where decisions are made. That's why it ain't gonna happen. Truly depressing.

'Stop de kindermood' was an emergent social behaviour directly resulting from the civil disobedience and unrest of the 70s oil crises, when oil importing nations felt the impacts of of exporter embargos, these resulted in mass grass roots protests and a desire to do things differently. For whatever reason, the UK didn't experience the necessary combination of events to trigger it's own moment. It's unfortunate that the economic downturn resulting from of the next wave of oil and energy shocks will hamstring any movement to invest in cycling infrastructure.

On the plus side, once the majority of cars are off the road, we'll have a nice network of wide paved roads and motorways to ride on, traffic free :laugh:
 
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