Why does my cassette creak loudly on free-hub body ?

Globalti

Legendary Member
**Thread hijack: why does the cassette on my Ti Hope freehub body creak loudly no matter how tight I do up the lockring? The "leading" edges of the splines are worn away by about 1mm both inside and outside the area occupied by the alloy spider on the bigger cassette rings. It's an 8 speed cassette - maybe I should try packing out behind it with a 1 mm spacer ring?


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Location
Loch side.
Are you talking about his type of damage?
Soft Freewheel Body Resized.jpg


This is a Hope aluminium freehub body. I didn't know they made a Ti one, just stainless steel. Learn something new every day.

If this is the damage, then your creaking is almost certainly from the individual sprockets in your cassette eating into the soft alu body. Alu complains like hell when steel bites it. Copper compound will silence it for a short while.

Packing a spacer in there will not solve the problem nor will more torque on the lockring. The lockring doesn't prevent movement between cassette and freewheel body, that you can see when you fit a soft body. Axial force cannot prevent tangential force in this case. this wasn't the case in freewheels. (technically this is a freehub) that screwed on. The more you pedaled, the tighter it became. The cassette solution was designed to prevent exactly that. The lockring only holds the cassette in place and gives it a bit of preload so that it doesn't move left/right (axially).



The only solution is a harder freewheel body and stainless steel is your friend here.
 
OP
Globalti

Globalti

Legendary Member
Are you talking about his type of damage?
View attachment 76724

This is a Hope aluminium freehub body. I didn't know they made a Ti one, just stainless steel. Learn something new every day.

If this is the damage, then your creaking is almost certainly from the individual sprockets in your cassette eating into the soft alu body. Alu complains like hell when steel bites it. Copper compound will silence it for a short while.

Packing a spacer in there will not solve the problem nor will more torque on the lockring. The lockring doesn't prevent movement between cassette and freewheel body, that you can see when you fit a soft body. Axial force cannot prevent tangential force in this case. this wasn't the case in freewheels. (technically this is a freehub) that screwed on. The more you pedaled, the tighter it became. The cassette solution was designed to prevent exactly that. The lockring only holds the cassette in place and gives it a bit of preload so that it doesn't move left/right (axially).

The only solution is a harder freewheel body and stainless steel is your friend here.
Thanks. Yes, this is a very early Hope freehub which, so I've always believed, were made from titanium. It's done well to get this far really. The wear is in even bands for about a 10mm stretch of the "leading" edges so I'm guessing that the creaking is caused by the fact that some of the cogs of the freehub are able to move radially while others aren't or the alloy spider isn't. Tightening the lockring during the C2C to "eff-off" tight did reduce the creaking a little; I guess I'm just going to have to soak everything in a medium-weight oil to quieten it down. Not something I like to do because oil attracts and holds dirt.

Land Rovers used to suffer a similar problem of wear to the splines of the gearbox output shaft where it entered the transfer box; it's a cool, poorly lubricated, remote area where condensation collects and probably contributes to the wear. Older 90/110s, Defenders, Range Rovers and Discoveries will have a characteristic "clack" that you hear on taking up drive (amongst all the other transmission sounds) that slowly gets worse until the splines give way and suddenly you've no drive. Land Rover solved it by lengthening the area of splined interface and drilling a hole through the input bearing so as to improve lubrication. I've seen pictures of bodges where unscrupulous sellers have actually driven nails into the gaps between the splines via the transfer box take-off cover to stop the backlash. It's a bodge but I wonder if packing or shimming the splines on the freehub body in some way might reduce the creaking?

Worn_Mainshaft.jpg
 
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Smurfy

Naturist Smurf
My Hope Ti-Glide hub doesn't creak, but the splines got slightly damaged, making cassette removal and installation more difficult. I have gently filed the raised areas to make the cassette go on easily again.
 

Levo-Lon

Guru
Sometimes ive used a bit of 25mm x10 mm roof batton wood placed on the cassette,in the 9 o'clock postion.. then give it a tap in anti clock direction ,it will spin but usually frees it off the burs ,they do get pretty damn chewed over time.

hth
 
Location
Loch side.
We have to blame the weight weenies for this one. Shimano designed this spline in the 1980s and it has stood the test of time until these deviants came over and insisted the freehub body be made from lighter, inappropriate stuff. Bhah!

Luckily, the eating is self-arresting The aluminium work-hardens and eventually is hard enough to resist the cassette's bulldozing.
 

themosquitoking

Veteran
Location
Spain
I've got some wheels made by American classics and the alu freehub has steel inserts along the leading edge of the ridges so they are in contact with the steel cassette instead of soft old alu.
 
Location
Loch side.
We have to blame the weight weenies for this one. Shimano designed this spline in the 1980s and it has stood the test of time until these deviants came over and insisted the freehub body be made from lighter, inappropriate stuff. Bhah!
I've got some wheels made by American classics and the alu freehub has steel inserts along the leading edge of the ridges so they are in contact with the steel cassette instead of soft old alu.
Yes, that's a brilliant design of theirs and patented. It is interesting that Shimano held the patent for the spine shape but never managed to fix the problem when trends moved to lighter materials. They attempted with Dura Ace to introduce a deep spline ala Campagnolo, but that failed miserably. Yet, they never throught of strengthening the edges with steel like American Classic did. AC has a nice patent on spoke nipples as well.
 

themosquitoking

Veteran
Location
Spain
Yes, that's a brilliant design of theirs and patented. It is interesting that Shimano held the patent for the spine shape but never managed to fix the problem when trends moved to lighter materials. They attempted with Dura Ace to introduce a deep spline ala Campagnolo, but that failed miserably. Yet, they never throught of strengthening the edges with steel like American Classic did. AC has a nice patent on spoke nipples as well.
Wow, good on them that they could patent it, seems silly to buy any other freehub after that info. I do like the noise of the freewheel on it to, a loud one but a real quality sound.
 
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