With all the deaths from left turning lorries in London...

[BentMikey]

Has anyone seen Ice Road Truckers - Most Dangerous Roads ?

Its set in India where the roads are crowded, dangerous or both. The construction trucks are sent with two people, a driver and a spotter who acts as a second set of eyes and can jump out and guide where necessary.

An idea so simple, so achievable, so obvious.

I loved that programme so much!! I like the idea too, but it's not helping much in India, it seems. Or maybe it is, and the utter madness of the rest of it is simply outweighing any effect.

 

[BentMikey]

True, and also not much use for those silly, silly cyclists who bung up their lugholes with iPods.

I hope you only drive your car with the windows open so you can hear properly, and never use the radio!!!

 

[Little yellow Brompton]

Of course, if they are in a directed lane (i.e. a lane which is for a specific turn) then there is no requirement to indicate. Other roads users should be aware of their intentions by their positioning.

There is every need to indicate. What about the traffic behind that can't see the road markings , becuase a lorry/bus is on top of them?
Taffic coming the other way, who can't see the road markings because the angle is too shallow ( or a lorry/bus is ...etc...)?
Taffic roads joining who can't see becuase of the shallow angle , or the corner or a lorry/bus etyc..?
Pedess who are not used to looking at road markings or can't see becuase a lorry/bus ....?

A signal should be used whenever anyone would benefit from it.

 

[Twanger]

I hope you only drive your car with the windows open so you can hear properly, and never use the radio!!!

I don't have a car.

 

[BentMikey]

Well then I hope you complain equally about all the car drivers driving with all windows closed and/or their stereos on. Anything less would be hypocritical.

 

[Markymark]

I would never cycle with headphones as it supresses an important sense of what is behind me. I do have the radio in the car as I have mirrors for this instead.

 

[guitarpete247]

Of course, if they are in a directed lane (i.e. a lane which is for a specific turn) then there is no requirement to indicate. Other roads users should be aware of their intentions by their positioning.

What about letting others know what lane you intend to use/change to. I indicate at every junction or turn and have even been known to indicate at the odd bend in the road if there could be the option of going left and right like here where I have indicated left

. I hate following those drivers (and cyclists) who think they are in the secret service and the direction they are going is on a need to know basis .

 

[Twanger]

Well then I hope you complain equally about all the car drivers driving with all windows closed and/or their stereos on. Anything less would be hypocritical.

The reason I don't drive is that I get freaked out by the feeling of being cut off from the outside world in a car. I got my driving licence very late (36) and I have never been comfortable in control of 4 hermetically sealed wheels.

But I do think, as others have said, that you have mirrors in a car, and bike mirrors are not the same thing. The dynamic, as someone said, is also different.

I think you know this, and are really just pissed off by the way I have been calling cyclists silly all the time in this thread. You have a point, and I am sorry.

 

[Jezston]

Sigh.

Wearing heaphones, listening to music whatever doesn't make you deaf - that's why manufacturers relatively recently developed noise cancelling technology in headphones, which doesn't really work anyway.

Besides, you shouldn't be making decisions based on sound alone. If some dozy ipod wearing nodder suddenly careens into someone's path without looking and causes a collision, it was because they didn't look not because they didn't listen.

 

[Twanger]

Sigh.

Wearing heaphones, listening to music whatever doesn't make you deaf - that's why manufacturers relatively recently developed noise cancelling technology in headphones, which doesn't really work anyway.

Besides, you shouldn't be making decisions based on sound alone. If some dozy ipod wearing nodder suddenly careens into someone's path without looking and causes a collision, it was because they didn't look not because they didn't listen.

Look, I don't want to argue for the sake of it, but I do want to talk about this because it's interesting.


I'm slightly deaf. I can hear quiet noises, very quiet noises in fact, and I still have a reasonable ear for high frequencies for my age (52), considering the amount of loud rocknroll I have listened to and played. But what I can't do is distinguish sounds when there's more than one thing going on. I can't hear what people are saying if music is playing, and I have to turn the music down. This is something I have had since I was a kid. That's why I could never stick an iPod in my ears while cycling. Ever.

That's me, though, my disability.

But I also notice that when I say good morning to people at work who still have their ear buds in, they don't hear me. I have asked people on the tube to turn down their ipods, to have them take their ear buds out and say "What?"

I wonder how often ipodding cyclists are actually aware of their environment, and how often they are just pootling with a pedestrian mentality, assuming that others will look out for them.

 

[CopperCyclist]

Five seconds after a lorry left indicates, a shower system is activated on the left side, spraying (non toxic) flourescent yellow paint out. Not only does it deter undertakers, but it makes determined ones more visible if they survive!

(obviously)

 

[Jezston]

Five seconds after a lorry left indicates, a shower system is activated on the left side, spraying (non toxic) flourescent yellow paint out. Not only does it deter undertakers, but it makes determined ones more visible if they survive!

(obviously)

And also makes random pedestrians more visible, thus safer when crossing the road!

 

[Buddfox]

Five seconds after a lorry left indicates, a shower system is activated on the left side, spraying (non toxic) flourescent yellow paint out. Not only does it deter undertakers, but it makes determined ones more visible if they survive!

(obviously)

Not a bad idea...!

 

[BentMikey]

The reason I don't drive is that I get freaked out by the feeling of being cut off from the outside world in a car. I got my driving licence very late (36) and I have never been comfortable in control of 4 hermetically sealed wheels.

But I do think, as others have said, that you have mirrors in a car, and bike mirrors are not the same thing. The dynamic, as someone said, is also different.

I think you know this, and are really just pissed off by the way I have been calling cyclists silly all the time in this thread. You have a point, and I am sorry.

Nah, I'm not annoyed, there are plenty of silly cyclists for us to shout at. I'm really interested in your story about driving though, thanks a lot for sharing that!!! Coming from a heavy car culture country, it's an eye opener for me here in the UK with so many people not having cycled or driven until later in life.

 

[Jezston]

Look, I don't want to argue for the sake of it, but I do want to talk about this because it's interesting.

No problem with that, as long as I don't end up getting flack for it from people again.

I'm slightly deaf. I can hear quiet noises, very quiet noises in fact, and I still have a reasonable ear for high frequencies for my age (52), considering the amount of loud rocknroll I have listened to and played. But what I can't do is distinguish sounds when there's more than one thing going on. I can't hear what people are saying if music is playing, and I have to turn the music down. This is something I have had since I was a kid. That's why I could never stick an iPod in my ears while cycling. Ever.

That's me, though, my disability.

But I also notice that when I say good morning to people at work who still have their ear buds in, they don't hear me. I have asked people on the tube to turn down their ipods, to have them take their ear buds out and say "What?"

Some fair points.

Regarding hearing speech - I guess as most music is focused around the human voice i.e. singing, rapping etc then of all available sources of sound out there this is the most likely to be interfered with. I'd suggest it would be the same as if two people were talking to you at the same time - I'd argue that you would still notice the other person talking - one wouldn't make you completely unaware of the other - but you'd struggle to make out the specifics of what both of them are saying.

Unless you were listening to particularly heavy metal, dubstep or some kind of avant garde noise music, I'd argue that this won't interfere with the sound of general traffic noise, but that even then you would still be aware of both, much as you would be aware of them amongst the general fug of noise that surrounds us in busy urban environments anyway.

I guess I am coming from a different perspective however, I am a sound engineer of sorts by trade, and it is an essential part of my job to be able to listen out for stuff other people might not notice, and maybe that's giving me somewhat of an advantage over others, but the main crux of my argument is that additional noise doesn't stop you hearing others - the main thing is just paying attention, and I guess some people might find that hard when listening to music, but I suspect the issue with 'iPod zombies' is more from their wilful inattentiveness than from the act of listening to music itself. Take the iPod off people like that and I'm sure they'd still ride like bellends.