Rangers Liquidation

[Theseus]

Time may prove me wrong, but I think that the smaller clubs will have to vote for Rangers2 to join them in next year's SPL, although one would expect them to go for some cast-iron guarantees about the new company.

As SPL are due to release next seasons fixture list on Monday, which includes Rangers, it looks that way.

 

[gavintc]

Sadly, I think as Touche has pointed out that with the fixture list about to be published that the decision has effectively been taken to include them in the SPL. I also propose that many of the other clubs in the SPL are probably trading with embarrassing debt themselves and that to vote out one of the members when they themselves are not beyond reproach is an invidious position. It seems that the we have a state in football clubs that would not be acceptable in main stream business.

 

[Doseone]

Listening to Talksport this morning while in the car, someone "close to" the Blue Knights was indicating there may yet be a few twists and turns in terms of new owners coming in.

Even if that doesn't happen I would still be surprised not to see them in the SPL next season.

 

[redcard]

The fixture list has absolutely no bearing on Rangers being in the SPL next season. No decision has been taken to kick them out, so the name 'Rangers' is effectively a placeholder until that decision is made.

Rangers in division 3 could be the best thing to happen to Scottish football, with every team in the lower leagues getting a financial boost and a spike in media interest over the next few seasons. I'm sure the bigots would be out in force aswell, seeing as they 'don't do walking away'.

 

[Smokin Joe]

Listening to Talksport this morning while in the car, someone "close to" the Blue Knights was indicating there may yet be a few twists and turns in terms of new owners coming in.

They're just trying to buy time, no one in their right mind would buy Rangers. There may well be someone who shows an apparent interest, but as is often the case when a football club is up for grabs someone who wants the publicity and a giggle at the books will pretend to be up for it.

 

[Archie_tect]

Looks like HMRC will own it unless they foreclose.

 

[Mad Doug Biker]

My Sister's boyfriend is a big Rangers supporter.

Apparently he's been feeling unwell for the past couple of days

 

[Doseone]

They're just trying to buy time, no one in their right mind would buy Rangers. There may well be someone who shows an apparent interest, but as is often the case when a football club is up for grabs someone who wants the publicity and a giggle at the books will pretend to be up for it.

I thought the same as you, but apparently, by going this route you buy the club clean ie free from debt. This means you can pick up a lot of real estate (The stadium etc and a large car park) for about £5m. I wasn't listening long enough to get the full ins and outs but that was the gist as I understood it.

 

[redcard]

I thought the same as you, but apparently, by going this route you buy the club clean ie free from debt. This means you can pick up a lot of real estate (The stadium etc and a large car park) for about £5m. I wasn't listening long enough to get the full ins and outs but that was the gist as I understood it.

Surely every man and his dog would take that for £5 million? Even the squad is worth at least that.

 

[Smokin Joe]

I thought the same as you, but apparently, by going this route you buy the club clean ie free from debt. This means you can pick up a lot of real estate (The stadium etc and a large car park) for about £5m. I wasn't listening long enough to get the full ins and outs but that was the gist as I understood it.

How can you buy a club free from debt? The debts come with the business and HMRC aren't going to walk away just because they have new owners. Tottenham Hotspur still had to clear tax debts after Alan Sugar bought the club and discovered the previous regime had been cooking the books.

 

[redcard]

How can you buy a club free from debt? The debts come with the business and HMRC aren't going to walk away just because they have new owners. Tottenham Hotspur still had to clear tax debts after Alan Sugar bought the club and discovered the previous regime had been cooking the books.

I don't think Tottenham were ever liquidated, or in administration, right?

What I don't understand is why the assets aren't being sold off to settle the debts

 

[Smokin Joe]

I don't think Tottenham were ever liquidated, or in administration, right?

What I don't understand is why the assets aren't being sold off to settle the debts

Sorry, forgot the Admin bit.

 

[Doseone]

How can you buy a club free from debt? The debts come with the business and HMRC aren't going to walk away just because they have new owners. Tottenham Hotspur still had to clear tax debts after Alan Sugar bought the club and discovered the previous regime had been cooking the books.

The debts come with Old Rangers. £5.5m is the figure that the administrators have accepted from Charles Green to buy the clubs assets to form new Rangers. HMRC will pursue Old Rangers and the individuals responsible for the debts. The debts are nothing to do with new Rangers. This is why HMRC felt this arrangement better protected the clubs future, because if they accepted a CVA any buyer would be taking on the liabilities as they would be buying Old Rangers.
That's just my simplistic view of how I think it works, am happy to be corrected if I've misunderstood.

 

[threebikesmcginty]

It really winds me up that directors can legally walk away from debts owed to working people by going into administration when it's too late and they can blithely set up another company and do exactly the same all over again. The knock-on effect can be catastrophic and should be outlawed.

We see that so often in construction, there was one a few years ago where one of the subbies, who'd lost quite a few grand to a firm, went round to the MD's house and belted him one, didn't get him any cash but it did get him some satisfaction! They'd already set up a new firm before the old one went under, a quick Companies House check told me that. We dealt with the new company on a pro-forma basis until we'd made enough back to cover previous debt then told 'em to f*ck off!

 

[007fair]

The debts come with Old Rangers. £5.5m is the figure that the administrators have accepted from Charles Green to buy the clubs assets to form new Rangers. HMRC will pursue Old Rangers and the individuals responsible for the debts. The debts are nothing to do with new Rangers. This is why HMRC felt this arrangement better protected the clubs future, because if they accepted a CVA any buyer would be taking on the liabilities as they would be buying Old Rangers.
That's just my simplistic view of how I think it works, am happy to be corrected if I've misunderstood.

About right ...but if the CVA was accepted the liabilities would be 9% of what they are now.

I think the laws around newco's are based on the economic principle that it's better to write off oldco debts and give newco half a chance, than to sell off all the old business so completely that no new one can possible exist. In the bigger picture of things this is better for the economy of the country ..but of course in this case its more personal / emotional than that.

I for one would feel uneasy if newco Rangers were admitted back into the SPL
They would exist just as before with the same support and fixed assets - whats changed?

Scottish football should ask itself if the TV / gate money being lost by Rangers going into the 3rd division is the be all and end all. Over the last 20 years the SPL has had that money and what good has it done anyone, except the Old Firm ? Scottish football has been on a slippery slope for all that time, mainly due to the overwhelming financial might of the old firm. Do we want to step straight back into the same scenario?

It doesn't have to be this way!

Up to the late 1980's many scottish clubs could challenge and win competitions that the old firm were in .. even in europe. Since then the SPL has been appalling. TV money just widens the gap between the rich and poor.
Vote for a competitive league not for a bit more cash and then sit back and watch the old firm ruin our league.