20mph Speed Limits

Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.
+1

The words "motor vehicle" appear quite often in the road traffic act and mean that there are quite a few rules that don't apply to cyclists. Speed limits are one, using a mobile phone while cycling is quite legal (as long as you are not riding dangerously because of it) and even the alchohol limit does not apply (I know you can be pulled over for drunk cycling, but you have to be unable to ride safely not just over the specified limit).

just another reason that cycling is better than driving
thumbsup.png


Wrong, wrong, wrong and wrong.

Corkery Vs. Carpenter 1951.

The defendant was succesfully prosecuted under the licensing act 1872 for being drunk whilst in charge of a bicycle on a public road.

After lengthy debates the courts declared that a bicycle is covered under the terms of "carriage" for the purpose of s.12 of the licensing act 1872. This was applied under the "mischief rule" of the rules of interpretation, whereby a judge can interpret legislation in such a way to give the statute the lawful affect for which it was intended.
 

benb

Evidence based cyclist
Location
Epsom
As a driver of 20-odd years and someone who took and passed the IAM course, I think my driving isn't too bad. Five seconds was, of course, an exaggeration, but I do not believe that rigid enforcement of speed limits is beneficial to road safety.

BTW, I break the speed limit all the time - pretty much every day. Sometimes I drive massively under the speed limit. I use my observation to judge what is a safe speed, not a number on a stick. Clean licence too, and always has been.

Arrogant and dangerous. This attitude stinks.
I hope you are not driving on any roads near me.
 

Parrot of Doom

New Member
Arrogant and dangerous. This attitude stinks.
I hope you are not driving on any roads near me.

My attitude has kept me and everyone around me safe and sound for many years. I view speed limit signs as a guide to what is generally considered to be a maximum safe speed, but nothing more. If you've any experience driving then you'll understand that many speed limits are now set not on technical grounds, but on political grounds. A road near me, the A6144 (formerly A6144(M)) is a case in point.

You probably now think I drive around with my foot pressed to the floor everywhere I go, but you couldn't be further from the truth.


If you're one of those people who believe that speed is the most important factor in the determination of safe driving, then I can only say you're ignorant. And I don't mean that to be an insult. Do yourself a favour, go and read Roadcraft. There are many, many aspects to safe driving, and speed is one of the least significant.
 

dawesome

Senior Member
I'm pretty sure the London 20mph zones will be policed by average speed cameras:

http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/stand...ds-of-speed-cameras-to-enforce-20mph-zones.do

The devices would be used to enforce 20mph zones and may even replace speed humps. Hackney said it wanted 20mph limits on all its residential roads.A council spokeswoman said: “This has been shown to significantly reduce accidents, and residents have told us they support this proposal.”

 

BentMikey

Rider of Seolferwulf
Location
South London
Or a good safespeed bullsh1t artist press officer.

A driver who thinks he/she is good enough to exceed the speed limit daily has immediately proved that they don't have the judgement to deserve holding a driving license. OTOH I'd fully accept that there are many other skills to safe driving and road use, but that doesn't change the fact that exceeding the speed limit is an instant fail on your driving test.
 

Parrot of Doom

New Member
When I took my driving test Mikey, I exceeded the speed limit. It was expected of you. Driving at 28mph in a clear, wide, 30 zone would be more likely to achieve a fail as you would be deemed to be holding up the flow of traffic.

You might not believe me but that's how I was taught, that's how I took my test, and that's one of the reasons why I passed without comment.

So what's the speed limit on the road I posted? If you don't know, you shouldn't be on the road.
 

dawesome

Senior Member
My attitude has kept me and everyone around me safe and sound for many years. I view speed limit signs as a guide to what is generally considered to be a maximum safe speed, but nothing more. If you've any experience driving then you'll understand that many speed limits are now set not on technical grounds, but on political grounds. A road near me, the A6144 (formerly A6144(M)) is a case in point.

You're quite big on grandiose claims based on zero evidence aren't you? This reminds me of my little brother who keeps sending me 9/11 conspiracy videos. I blame the X Factor, the process of cheap tawdry dumbing down of the population.

Politicians don't set speed limits, that's paranoid ramblings. People with a lot more experience of road safety than your or me set speed limits, or, as in the London example, the residents themselves clamour for speed reductions so that twatty little boy racers no longer use public roads as their own personal racetrack.



If you're one of those people who believe that speed is the most important factor in the determination of safe driving, then I can only say you're ignorant. And I don't mean that to be an insult. Do yourself a favour, go and read Roadcraft. There are many, many aspects to safe driving, and speed is one of the least significant.

You disagree with the BMJ research set out upthread? On what grounds please? Their research confirmed the findings of TRL421, which you've ignored (whoever said you'd make a good politician was on the money!). Increased speeds mean more accidents and more severe injuries. That's a fact, and to pre-empt your triumphant presentation of accident rates on motorways, that's a load of old trousers, there are no cyclists on motorways, no corner shops, schools, zebra crossings, pedestrians or pubs.

Up and down the country people are fed up to the back teeth with people who delude themselves that bombing along public roads above the speed limit is safe driving. Even if you are lucky enough not to smash into someone and tear a family apart you are still being anti-social, aggressive, bullying and intimidatory, there doesn't have to be an accident for speeding to have a negative impact on the people unlucky enough to live on the roads you use to break the law on. Claiming to be a good driver whilst boasting of speeding is just breathtaking chutzpah, it's like claiming to be a good father because you only punch your children in the face on Sundays, get a grip man, wake up to what you're doing, just get out of bed earlier or set off a few minutes earlier. Swallow as much of the Safespeed bum gravy as you like, just don't you dare carry over their inane ramblings into real life and onto roads you share with me.
 

dawesome

Senior Member
Driving at 28mph in a clear, wide, 30 zone would be more likely to achieve a fail as you would be deemed to be holding up the flow of traffic.

There we go again.

Ok, I'll bite, you got a source for this? An example of someone failing their driving test for doing 28 in a 30, he asked with little hope of a sensible answer.
 

jds_1981

Active Member
The danger is you are talking about perception and not facts (as best we can determine them). I, as a motorist and a cyclists, hate bumps. I think they divert my attention. But the bottom line is statistics point very strongly that you are safer on a 20mph humped street than a 30mph unhumped one. By avoiding them you may paradoxically be putting yourself in greater danger.

There is of course the chance that as speed restrictions are added to more thoroughfare routes things become more complicated. A B road I commute on is a 20 there is a lot of maneuvering by cars to avoid speed bumps that put them in conflict with cyclists..

http://maps.google.co.uk/?ll=51.547...=KP8tb44Lj9XezE8X7-dI4A&cbp=12,162.52,,0,9.25
 

Parrot of Doom

New Member
Dawesome you seem to be taking this a little bit too personally. I'm not interesting in getting into a slanging match with you or anyone else here. I never said that politicians set speed limits, and I wasn't about to mention motorways either.

Safe to say I consider myself to be a safe driver with above average driving skills (and please, don't start with the obvious reply there, because I know all about that), and someone who while cycling, you would definitely rather encounter over the mouth-breathing idiots who think they own the road and who think that cyclists are beneath them.

If you'd rather believe that someone who doesn't adhere absolutely to a rigid system of rules is going to be a dangerous nutter, then that's your prerogative.

As for my claim about my driving test, it's anecdotal, and may have been restricted to the area I was tested in. But I'd rather trust to my own experiences and the lessons I was taught by my driving instructor, than go running around the internet to satisfy your lust for "victory".

If you start making this personal, trust that your postings will be ignored.
 

benb

Evidence based cyclist
Location
Epsom
My attitude has kept me and everyone around me safe and sound for many years.

More by luck than judgement, I would submit.

I view speed limit signs as a guide to what is generally considered to be a maximum safe speed, but nothing more.

Breathtaking arrogance. Which other laws do you pick and choose whether to bother complying with, on the basis that you know better?


If you've any experience driving then you'll understand that many speed limits are now set not on technical grounds, but on political grounds. A road near me, the A6144 (formerly A6144(M)) is a case in point.

Paranoid, conspiratorial drivel. Politicians, I'm sure, would love to be able to relax speed limits, given how popular it would be with sections of the electorate. Luckily it's not up to them.

You probably now think I drive around with my foot pressed to the floor everywhere I go, but you couldn't be further from the truth.

I don't think that, but conclude from what you've said that you often drive dangerously fast.


If you're one of those people who believe that speed is the most important factor in the determination of safe driving, then I can only say you're ignorant. And I don't mean that to be an insult. Do yourself a favour, go and read Roadcraft. There are many, many aspects to safe driving, and speed is one of the least significant.

Absolute rubbish. Increase in speed will not only increase the likelihood of an accident due to increased reaction and stopping distance, but will increase the severity of any accident. I agree that there are many other aspects to safe driving, but speed is one of the most significant, not the least.

You're a danger to yourself and others.
 

jds_1981

Active Member
Also worth taking note of - what are the trade-offs people are willing to make regarding speed against accidents? If no-one was allowed to go above 5 mph (including joggers, cyclists, cars) serious accidents would be reduced to near zero. I suspect that very few people are willing to go this far down the trade-off route though.
Another solution would by barriers between pavements and roads with a few designated crossing places. Once again, few people would like this solution..
 

dawesome

Senior Member
There is of course the chance that as speed restrictions are added to more thoroughfare routes things become more complicated. A B road I commute on is a 20 there is a lot of maneuvering by cars to avoid speed bumps that put them in conflict with cyclists..

http://maps.google.c...,162.52,,0,9.25

London's average speed cameras also use ANPR technology. 1 in 8 cars in Tottenham, for instance, is uninsured. It's a win/win!
 
Top Bottom