A cyclists life is cheap again

[si_c]

I think you're missing the point. Roads themselves aren't inherently unsafe (if we ignore those where the road surface itself is not up to scratch). Every road can be navigated safely if you drive appropriately.

It's not the roads that need to be made safer - it's the drivers.

I'm not missing the point, I think you are missing mine I agree that the drivers should navigate appropriately, my point is that given we know that they do not, can we not also change the roads to accomodate this fact. It's not either/or, it's both.

 

[si_c]

In Cheshire, a small minority of drivers have developed the ability to see around tight bends, either that or they just don't give a XXXX if they kill or seriously injure other road users.

Don't get me started on the Cheshire landroids.

 

[si_c]

Why change the roads if the roads aren't the issue? That's the point...

In an ideal world we wouldn't have to, but given that we do not live in an ideal world, acknowledging that we have a systemic problem identifying and removing shoot drivers from the roads, and adjusting the latter to make things better is in my opinion, prudent.

 

[Milkfloat]

Being somewhat twisted, the cost of a life is not so cheap - at ~£1.7 million for the fatality and £900K per year prison cost, perhaps you could argue that enforcement of driving standards and design of roads could work out cheaper. Not to mention the minor matter of the human cost.

 

[jefmcg]

My father, who was a road engineer, felt a lot of the cause of Princess Diana's death was on French road design. Yes, there was a high speed chase, a drunk driver, the shape-changing reptilian overlords but if that had happened in a tunnel in Australia (and the UK or US as well, I believe) then there would not have been a fatal accident, because there would not be a pillar like that unprotected by safety barriers, that vehicles slide off.

So yes, put the man in jail and throw away the key, but maybe also widen the road at that bend, and put an island in the middle, so there is no repeat of the accident.

 

[Poacher]

Being somewhat twisted, the cost of a life is not so cheap - at ~£1.7 million for the fatality and £900K per year prison cost, perhaps you could argue that enforcement of driving standards and design of roads could work out cheaper. Not to mention the minor matter of the human cost.

Where does the £900K per year figure come from? Is that what G4S charge?

 

[jefmcg]

Where does the £900K per year figure come from? Is that what G4S charge?

It seems to be pulled out of his ....

http://www.prisonreformtrust.org.uk/Portals/0/Documents/Prison the facts May 2015.pdf

£36,000. Still a lot of money.

 

[jefmcg]

Your father is wide of the mark. Columns like that are common in the UK. I can think of a number of tunnels in place like London or Birmingham with similar designs.

Ah, that wasn't him, that was me. Hence "(and the UK or US as well, I believe) ". He was just talking about Australia.

OK, so she was killed by European road design.

(for the record, Australia has a proportionately higher road toll than the UK, even when compared to distance travelled, so road design is not a panacea).

 

[Markymark]

Ah, that wasn't him, that was me. Hence "(and the UK or US as well, I believe) ". He was just talking about Australia.

OK, so she was killed by European road design.

There was me thinking it was by a driver who had been drinking alcohol driving too fast and a passenger without a seatlbelt

 

[si_c]

Where does the £900K per year figure come from? Is that what G4S charge?

Sounds somewhat inflated to me. Depending on the category of prisoner it's probably closer to £90k per prisoner per year. It costs around £30k per year (2014 figures) to service each prison place, and an additional £30k per year or so per prisoner. This depends on the category of prisoner etc. I'm not sure if that includes additional overheads I didn't read the report in too much detail. If I'm wrong, please feel free to tell me (like you wouldn't anyway) The report can be found here https://www.gov.uk/government/uploa...st-per-place-and-prisoner-2013-14-summary.pdf

 

[PhilDawson8270]

The only way I can see this changing is if there is a material increase in road deaths of any kind and/or EU legislation enforcing a minimum KSI % (assuming we are still in the EU of course) which will then cause the government to look at ways of reducing road deaths. This may lead to tougher penalties/changes in law/changes in the social mindset as a result of education and awareness.

Though, it is far more likely that they take the easy option. Ban bicycles from roads

 

[jefmcg]

There was me thinking it was by a driver who had been drinking alcohol driving too fast and a passenger without a seatlbelt

Yes,that's also true, plus the shape-shifting lizards as mentioned above. But if that had all happened on a road with crash barriers, there would have been no fatality.

And yes, if she'd done up her seatbeat instead of behaving like an entitled princess - but I guess if anyone could, she could.

 

[Markymark]

Yes,that's also true, plus the shape-shifting lizards as mentioned above. But if that had all happened on a road with crash barriers, there would have been no fatality.

And yes, if she'd done up her seatbeat instead of behaving like an entitled princess

What would you think would happen when crash barriers are fitted as standard on roads? Do you think drivers would maintain their current risk attitude or do you think they might take more risks as it's now 'safer'?

The advent of airbags, ABS, traction control etc shows that all people now do is drive faster with less care for others.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

A road isn't dangerous until it has a driver on it.

GC

 

[jefmcg]

What would you think would happen when crash barriers are fitted as standard on roads? Do you think drivers would maintain their current risk attitude or do you think they might take more risks as it's now 'safer'?

I think most drivers are unaware of this particular safety feature - I couldn't, for example, remember if they are present on British roads or not, because I generally don't notice or think about them. So in this case I suspect it makes no difference.