A question for veggies

[User482]

I can see that eating honey could be argued to be exploitation of bees (because in the wild, they don't produce honey for our benefit), but then wouldn't the same argument apply to plants? In any case, commercial cultivation of plants undoubtedly results in the death of insects.

 

[ChrisKH]

Just out of curiosity, why would a vegan eschew honey? The bees aren't killed, they're positively cosseted aren't they?

Possibly it takes x 000, 000 trips by one bee to make a pot of honey. You're working them to death for goodness sake. Each hive is a labour camp put together for the pleasure of your porridge.

 

[SavageHoutkop]

even though my diet may directly contribute to the deaths of calves, I'm responsible for less deaths than I would be if I ate meat.

I'm quite chuffed to have found a dairy where the calves are left with a mommy (not sure if it was their own mommy or a surrogate) and raised for veal rather than being shot at birth. Only problem is the veal isn't always available as the calves are still out in the field!! And it's a 'microdairy' so local only. Although milk comes in glass bottles and is unhomogonized - yum!

 

[Yellow Fang]

How did yello manage to correct the spelling of veges in the title?

 

[Becs]

I'm quite chuffed to have found a dairy where the calves are left with a mommy (not sure if it was their own mommy or a surrogate) and raised for veal rather than being shot at birth. Only problem is the veal isn't always available as the calves are still out in the field!! And it's a 'microdairy' so local only. Although milk comes in glass bottles and is unhomogonized - yum!

That sounds brilliant! I worked on a dairy farm during vet school that did much the same with their beef crosses (very tasty!), the problem comes with the friesian bull calves - not enough meat on them for veal/beef (in the eyes of the supermarkets) but you need to breed some cows to friesians to get the female calves to replace the old cows. As a large animal vet I wholeheartedly support the meat and dairy industries in this county - we have the best animal welfare standards in the world so I reckon if we buy local, or at least buy British then our consciences can be clear . . . as long as it's not halal/kosher!!!

 

[SavageHoutkop]

That sounds brilliant! I worked on a dairy farm during vet school that did much the same with their beef crosses (very tasty!), the problem comes with the friesian bull calves - not enough meat on them for veal/beef (in the eyes of the supermarkets) but you need to breed some cows to friesians to get the female calves to replace the old cows. As a large animal vet I wholeheartedly support the meat and dairy industries in this county - we have the best animal welfare standards in the world so I reckon if we buy local, or at least buy British then our consciences can be clear . . . as long as it's not halal/kosher!!!

These aren't Friesians, they're Ayrshire, but I take your point.
The milk would be perfect if it were Jersey/Guernsey now...

 

[yello]

How did yello manage to correct the spelling of veges in the title?

Now that would be telling

 

[661-Pete]

It's difficult to be definitive about what you ought to eat, and ought not to eat, if you're a veggie (or any other sort of '-tarian'). Why not just make a list, for your own purposes, of what you're prepared to eat, and what you're not prepared to eat? That's, more or less, what I did.

Of course if such a list had to itemise absolutely everything, it'd be not only tedious but utterly unworkable. To see what I mean, look at Leviticus. Pages and pages of "thou shalt not eat"s, and that's just for Kosher (they got it wrong anyway: Levit. allows you to eat 'locusts', but the Beth Din thinks different...)

So what I've decided is, nothing that comes from a killed mammal or bird. Simples. It means fish and invertebrates are OK. Also eggs and milk etc. (I shyly sidestep the difficult ethical stuff on dairy industry, 'cos my morals ain't that good...)

 

[battered]

As a large animal vet I wholeheartedly support the meat and dairy industries in this county -

They farm a lot of cows in Belsize Park then, do they?

The meat and dairy industry has to be looked at as a whole really.

As for slugs, there's no fundamental reason why you can't eat them apart from the fact that they eat some disgusting stuff. Rotting vegetable material is the nice end of their diet. You'd therefore have to gut them or purge them on something you'd be happy to eat for a few days. Snails are much the same to be fair, which is why the French ones come from farmed stock where they can keep them from eating things that have already been eaten once.

 

[Becs]

They farm a lot of cows in Belsize Park then, do they?

Haha! I'm doing a PhD at the Royal Vet College in Camden at the moment but I still do the vet stuff at the weekends in Buckinghamshire as a locum. Was a full time vet for a few years before the PhD started . . . .

 

[taxing]

It's difficult to be definitive about what you ought to eat, and ought not to eat, if you're a veggie (or any other sort of '-tarian'). Why not just make a list, for your own purposes, of what you're prepared to eat, and what you're not prepared to eat? That's, more or less, what I did.

Of course if such a list had to itemise absolutely everything, it'd be not only tedious but utterly unworkable. To see what I mean, look at Leviticus. Pages and pages of "thou shalt not eat"s, and that's just for Kosher (they got it wrong anyway: Levit. allows you to eat 'locusts', but the Beth Din thinks different...)

So what I've decided is, nothing that comes from a killed mammal or bird. Simples. It means fish and invertebrates are OK. Also eggs and milk etc. (I shyly sidestep the difficult ethical stuff on dairy industry, 'cos my morals ain't that good...)

So... you're a pescetarian, then?

 

[rich p]

So what I've decided is, nothing that comes from a killed mammal or bird. Simples. It means fish and invertebrates are OK. Also eggs and milk etc. (I shyly sidestep the difficult ethical stuff on dairy industry, 'cos my morals ain't that good...)

Without wishing to indulge in a deep philosophical debate worthy of P&L, why do you consider it okay to eat dead fish but not dead chicken?

I sincerely hope it doesn't come down to brain size otherwise I might become vulnerable to predators.

 

[Alun]

As for slugs, there's no fundamental reason why you can't eat them apart from the fact that they eat some disgusting stuff. Rotting vegetable material is the nice end of their diet. You'd therefore have to gut them or purge them on something you'd be happy to eat for a few days.

They've eaten most of the Hosta that I planted earlier this year!

You could use them to bulk out a curry I suppose, but I don't like the idea of it at all.

 

[dellzeqq]

I always thought that although snails are edible, slugs can be harmul to humans if eaten!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Feranley Whittingwotsit has a recipe, Keith!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!(I've always wanted to do that)

 

[661-Pete]

So... you're a pescetarian, then?

Remind me to get a label printed out, next time I pass the stationer's, to hang round my neck: "I AM A PESCE---[whatever]"

Actually, perhaps it'd better be the T-shirt...

Without wishing to indulge in a deep philosophical debate worthy of P&L, why do you consider it okay to eat dead fish but not dead chicken?

Oh I'm so glad you asked! Fear not, I'm not very philosophical.

I like fish.