BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
There you go - she was immediately beyond Mr P's giveway line, and he didn't.
Another blind one
- Thread starter User
- Start date
Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.
There you go - she was immediately beyond Mr P's giveway line, and he didn't.
BentMikey
Rider of Seolferwulf
- Location
- South London
I think you're missing the point? With MRABs you'll get shadings from in the right to very pushy, to in the wrong, often within fractions of a second given how impatiently people ride and drive, and how small MRABs are.
With Big Guy's video, the driver is clearly in the wrong, and with MrP's, I'd put the driver a little on the pushy side.
As for taking avoiding action - I'm not sure MrP took any. I wonder whether he didn't just slightly ride at her to make a point, hence my charging comment earlier.
Would all those who say the car driver was in the right like to mentally swap the positions of the car and the bike around?
Who would be in the "right" then? I can't see a car that was in the position MrP was in approaching actually stopping when they got to the MRAB because a bike had pulled out in front of them; can anyone else?
At best a fistful of car horn and a mouthful of abuse, at worst bike would be spread across the car and road.
The driver would be claiming that the bike should have given way, and no doubt everyone else would agree. So why should we apply the same rule one way for cars and lorries, and another for bikes?
Who would be in the "right" then? I can't see a car that was in the position MrP was in approaching actually stopping when they got to the MRAB because a bike had pulled out in front of them; can anyone else?
At best a fistful of car horn and a mouthful of abuse, at worst bike would be spread across the car and road.
The driver would be claiming that the bike should have given way, and no doubt everyone else would agree. So why should we apply the same rule one way for cars and lorries, and another for bikes?
Origamist
Legendary Member
Loooks like it's time for another silly hypothetical scenario and some fantastical figures...
If a traffic cop witnessed the incident who, if anyone, would s/he be most likley to have a roadside chat with?
a) Mr P (very unlikely - 5% chance)
b) Car driver (likely - 35%)
c) Do nothing and continue to eat a Kit-Kat Chunky (very likely - 60%)
If a traffic cop witnessed the incident who, if anyone, would s/he be most likley to have a roadside chat with?
a) Mr P (very unlikely - 5% chance)
b) Car driver (likely - 35%)
c) Do nothing and continue to eat a Kit-Kat Chunky (very likely - 60%)
Inertia
I feel like I could... TAKE ON THE WORLD!!
I think there is a 50/50 chance of this ending the argument, though there's only a 10% chance of that.
campbellab
Senior Member
- Location
- Swindon
The immediately beyond is for the driver giving way. ie it suggests you can stop AFTER the giveway line to giveway to someone already on the roundabout. I only highlighted it as it seems crazy that you can stick your nose out into the roundabout?! However those are different lines than in this scenario and that statement therefore has no bearing on this case. Except to add confusion about our poorly designed mini roundabout systems
The actual lines in this scenario are double giveway lines and you are not to proceed over them if it causes anyone else on the main carriageway to make avoiding action. MrP proceeded and did not cause anyone else to take avoiding action, so to the letter of the law did nothing wrong
Again check the times in the video for when she actually crosses the line and when MrP crosses the line, there is less than 2 seconds in it... Add to that MrP is checking his right side just before/as she enters. I don't think he could have stopped before the giveway line. He was correctly expecting her to give priority to him (although maybe not anticipating quite well enough). She then took an abnormal route around the roundabout making the problem slightly worse.
As trichens suggests, swop the situation for a lorry approaching the roundabout with a stationary bike at the lines. The bike should give priority but decides to enter anyway. He has no way of clearing the path of the lorry but you expect the lorry should giveway because the bike is already on the roundabout circulating? I don't think a judge would see it that way?
cameramanjim
Getting faster, very slowly
- Location
- Battersea, London
That´s completely wrong (and a little dumb). Obviously you don´t get right of way ´no matter how far away´but you do when you are practically on the roundabout. Right of way does NOT only apply once you are on the roundabout. (Check your highway code).
cameramanjim
Getting faster, very slowly
- Location
- Battersea, London
That´s NOT how roundabouts work. Check your highway code. You give way to any vehicle coming from your right whether your way is clear or not. To do anything else could be seen as DWDCA (driving without due care etc)
Evasive action ? If Mr P had spotted the 33.3 % of the traffic in his clip earlier and made allowances he could of entered the roundabout at a lesser speed and saved us the many pages of this thread.
Then we could all have concentrated on his riding a bike through a shopping centre clip...
gaz
Cycle Camera TV
- Location
- South Croydon
It would be wise to note that the highway code never says who has the right of way. Only when you should give way and who has priority.
MacB
Lover of things that come in 3's
- Location
- Farnborough, Hampshire
Hmmm, it's a MRAB even the laws of physics struggle to cope with them, I assume drivers will be rubbish at a MRAB, whether I'm cycling or driving.
Any cyclist on here would have anticipated what might happen there and we'd all have avoided it. I would contend that most of us would have included a lot more hanging back in that avoidance strategy. Purely because drivers can also be prone to that annoying habit of seeing you late, and then stopping right in front of you, rather than carrying on and getting out of the way. There'd probably be a nod to what's behind us and mental preparation for a pavement bailout, just in case, as well.
Whether running it closer makes for better video or is just an indication of a more agressive/confrontational riding style, I don't know. But there did seem to be a desire to get close enough to make a remark, again unsure as to whether that was just in case the drivers window was open, playing to the camera or a mild form of tourettes.
A truly pointless video of an 'incident' most of us wouldn't notice and almost none of us would remember, that's spawned a pointless debate. But maybe there's a 'getting your rocks off' aspect to cycling video footage that I fail to get in the same way I fail to get trainspotting and the like.
Any cyclist on here would have anticipated what might happen there and we'd all have avoided it. I would contend that most of us would have included a lot more hanging back in that avoidance strategy. Purely because drivers can also be prone to that annoying habit of seeing you late, and then stopping right in front of you, rather than carrying on and getting out of the way. There'd probably be a nod to what's behind us and mental preparation for a pavement bailout, just in case, as well.
Whether running it closer makes for better video or is just an indication of a more agressive/confrontational riding style, I don't know. But there did seem to be a desire to get close enough to make a remark, again unsure as to whether that was just in case the drivers window was open, playing to the camera or a mild form of tourettes.
A truly pointless video of an 'incident' most of us wouldn't notice and almost none of us would remember, that's spawned a pointless debate. But maybe there's a 'getting your rocks off' aspect to cycling video footage that I fail to get in the same way I fail to get trainspotting and the like.
Origamist
Legendary Member
Vids are the life-blood, the very marrow of CC Commuting, MacB - they facilitate pointless debate wonderfully and as such, I was planning to organise a poll of the best and worst clips of 2010. Don't you have a favourite Youtube mishap-moment?
Could we have a list of contenders? Should I start a new thread? Should I take a break from the interweb? Deal or No Deal?
crumpetman
Well-Known Member
As Easy As Riding A Bike
Well-Known Member
A debate and video so pointless you thought you would chime in with a long and slightly contentious comment that will probably extend the debate still further?
