Another electrical question.

[raleighnut]

Totally agree would you have expected your customers to modify something you had just installed to get functionality?

We'd have been sent back to rectify the problem but that was in commercial installations so 'elf and safety' would have been on it like a ton of bricks, I've made a bunch of display stands and counters with lights in em and for a safety certificate if they plug in the power point must be accessible in order that they can be fully isolated, if they're 'hard-wired' a fully certificated electrician must check everything before he connects it.

 

[Low Gear Guy]

Is it possible to access the supply cable to wire in a cord switch or a connector?

You will need to disconnect the whole house supply to do this as the MCB only switches live and the neutral will remain connected.

 

[raleighnut]

Is it possible to access the supply cable to wire in a cord switch or a connector?

You will need to disconnect the whole house supply to do this as the MCB only switches live and the neutral will remain connected.

That can only be done by a certified electrician these days

 

[stephec]

We'd have been sent back to rectify the problem but that was in commercial installations so 'elf and safety' would have been on it like a ton of bricks, I've made a bunch of display stands and counters with lights in em and for a safety certificate if they plug in the power point must be accessible in order that they can be fully isolated, if they're 'hard-wired' a fully certificated electrician must check everything before he connects it.

Is it possible to access the supply cable to wire in a cord switch or a connector?

You will need to disconnect the whole house supply to do this as the MCB only switches live and the neutral will remain connected.

This is pretty much the reason for my original question.

I first noticed it as the mcb for the upstairs sockets was tripping, so did the usual unplug everything, and then found that the light couldn't be disconnected.

There's another bedroom being fitted in a months time where this situation could potentially arise, so the fitters will be getting a call beforehand to be asked to remedy the first error at the same time.

It would just be nice if there was a relevant law/regulation that I could quote to them.

 

[subaqua]

Is it possible to access the supply cable to wire in a cord switch or a connector?

You will need to disconnect the whole house supply to do this as the MCB only switches live and the neutral will remain connected.

Unless it’s a TT system it’s not a problem. ESQCR 2002 confirms this.

IET wiring regs are not the law, but complying with will generally ensure compliance with the law. We are now in the transition to 18th edition which makes no changes to what’s being discussed here .

Access should have been cut as a best practice . It makes future testing an utter ballache.

Kitchen units with fused spurs behind them screams yeeha install.

 

[subaqua]

This is pretty much the reason for my original question.

I first noticed it as the mcb for the upstairs sockets was tripping, so did the usual unplug everything, and then found that the light couldn't be disconnected.

There's another bedroom being fitted in a months time where this situation could potentially arise, so the fitters will be getting a call beforehand to be asked to remedy the first error at the same time.

It would just be nice if there was a relevant law/regulation that I could quote to them.

513 ACCESSIBILITY
513.1
Except for a joint in cables where Section 526 allows such a joint to be inaccessible, every item of equipment shall be arranged so as to facilitate its operation, inspection and maintenance and access to each connection. Such facility shall not be significantly impaired by mounting equipment in an enclosure or a compartment.

526.3
Every connection shall be accessible for inspection, testing and maintenance, except for the following:
(i) Ajoint designed to be buried in the ground
(ii) A compound-filled or encapsulated joint
(iii) A connection between a cold tail and the heating element as in ceiling heating, floor heating or a trace heating system
(iv) A joint made by welding, soldering, brazing or appropriate compression tool
(v) Joints or connections made in equipment by the manufacturer of the product and not intended to be inspected or maintained
(vi) Equipment complying with BS 5733 for a maintenance-free accessory and marked with the symbol MF and installed in accordance with the manufacturer’s instructions.


They can’t argue point (v) applies in this instance

 

[stephec]

Thanks @subaqua that's what exactly what I was after.

 

[irw]

I'm going to go a little against the grain here, and say I wouldn't necessarily expect a wardrobe fitter to know the electrical regulations, and I certainly wouldn't expect them to start moving or modifying installed fittings. If you thought it was going to be a problem, you should have got a sparky in at the same time.

Rather than going in all guns blazing quoting regulations, why not simply mention to them that you'd like to be able to isolate it if needs be, and ask if they can cut a suitable access hole in the back?

Edited to add: Of course, as others have said, if the fitters had used a bit of common sense, they should have flagged this up, and made a suitable access hole/flap during the install.

 

[subaqua]

I'm going to go a little against the grain here, and say I wouldn't necessarily expect a wardrobe fitter to know the electrical regulations, and I certainly wouldn't expect them to start moving or modifying installed fittings. If you thought it was going to be a problem, you should have got a sparky in at the same time.

Rather than going in all guns blazing quoting regulations, why not simply mention to them that you'd like to be able to isolate it if needs be, and ask if they can cut a suitable access hole in the back?

Edited to add: Of course, as others have said, if the fitters had used a bit of common sense, they should have flagged this up, and made a suitable access hole/flap during the install.

This is the law
http://www.hse.gov.uk/pUbns/priced/hsr25.pdf

You can’t say you didn’t know if you are a commercial enterprise ...

Broad brush

Regulation 3 duty holders - everybody in an at work situation .
You could argue that Regulation 4 applies

 

[stephec]

I'm going to go a little against the grain here, and say I wouldn't necessarily expect a wardrobe fitter to know the electrical regulations, and I certainly wouldn't expect them to start moving or modifying installed fittings. If you thought it was going to be a problem, you should have got a sparky in at the same time.

Rather than going in all guns blazing quoting regulations, why not simply mention to them that you'd like to be able to isolate it if needs be, and ask if they can cut a suitable access hole in the back?

Edited to add: Of course, as others have said, if the fitters had used a bit of common sense, they should have flagged this up, and made a suitable access hole/flap during the install.

When did I mention all guns blazing?

I'll point out what I believe to be wrong and ask for it to be put right, then if needs be I'll be armed with the correct knowledge should they refuse.

 

[irw]

When did I mention all guns blazing?
I'll point out what I believe to be wrong and ask for it to be put right, then if needs be I'll be armed with the correct knowledge should they refuse.

Fair enough...poor wording on my part, sorry!

 

[stephec]

Fair enough...poor wording on my part, sorry!

That's alright, written words on here are always open to interpretation without facial gestures or tone of voice, I always prefer to explain something potentially tricky face to face, or at worst over the phone, rather than in writing.

 

[stephec]

That's alright, written words on here are always open to interpretation without facial gestures or tone of voice, I always prefer to explain something potentially tricky face to face, or at worst over the phone, rather than in writing.

Potentially, can you see what I did there?

Potential, electricity?

Ah forget it, if you have to explain ....

 

[subaqua]

Potentially, can you see what I did there?

Potential, electricity?

Ah forget it, if you have to explain ....

I was trying to ignore it ...

 

[DCBassman]

That's the only solution, but surely the wardrobe fitters should've done that originally?

I'd say yes to that as well.