Are we being forced to go electric?

[farfromtheland]

Back in the day generally both parents didn’t work . Didn’t need too I’m guessing. That came later once everyone was encouraged to be their house. So now we have people driving and dropping off at school before work. All of my work colleagues partners all work full time. All drive , all have more than one car .

There is almost nothing that makes me grumpier than the over-cooked mortgage economy.

Don't know the age range here, but do you remember 'Tomorrow's World' with James Burke? Early evening 1970s BBC. The 3 day week was seen as a boon of future technology! Bring it on!

Capitalist-enabling-style feminism left me out - I am a strong believer in bringing up your own children. 'Childcare' became the main demand rather than egalitarian parenthood sharing. Meanwhile, though, schools can have breakfast clubs, employers less inflexible working and working from home is now a big thing.

I do drive - but am trying to do a lot less of it. At least 50% less. But I wouldn't get an electric car or van even if I could afford one - seems like out of the frying pan into the fire all things considered.

 

[farfromtheland]

If methane gas could be cleanly harvested from farms and polar ice melts and rubbish dumps I think we could convert most petrol engines very easily. Intake through the air system and a relatively clean burn.

I'm not suggesting this on a large scale at this late stage! As a sort of mini-mad-max rural contingency it has a certain charm.

 

[figbat]

If methane gas could be cleanly harvested from farms and polar ice melts and rubbish dumps I think we could convert most petrol engines very easily. Intake through the air system and a relatively clean burn.

I'm not suggesting this on a large scale! But as a sort of mini-mad-max rural contingency it has a certain charm.

This is already done for power generation - landfill sites are mined for flammable gases which are fed into large engines which run generators. It is easier to do on-site as you don't need to compress/liquify and transport the gas - for mobility use you would have to, which all adds to the energy demand of the infrastructure.

 

[cougie uk]

There are a lot of people having to work to pay off huge mortgages and flashy car loans. Long commutes to get the big wages and long hours.
A simpler life with less frills might not be fashionable but it's a healthier way to go. For the planet and the person involved.

 

[Tenkaykev]

This is already done for power generation - landfill sites are mined for flammable gases which are fed into large engines which run generators. It is easier to do on-site as you don't need to compress/liquify and transport the gas - for mobility use you would have to, which all adds to the energy demand of the infrastructure.

Yes indeed, locally there’s a waste disposal centre that was once a quarry and is now a hill! They generate electricity from methane capture. A bridleway runs past it and you hear the occasional hiss as the anti odour sprays discharge. There’s also a small trading estate built on reclaimed land. The car parks and verges have ventilation poles that go deep into the ground and have stainless steel spinners mounted on the top to create negative pressure and draw the methane out.

 

[farfromtheland]

Even Boris Johnson was caught in soundbite saying that commuting was now off. Perhaps a PR faux-pas, but Radio London reported it and I wish I'd remembered his exact words.

Seems landfill might be rather greener than refuse burning for energy generation in the long run!

 

[mustang1]

That isn't all that much a of a change in real terms.

Taking 1988 as "late 80's", allowing for inflation, that £5,000 would now be £11,650

That's why I'm an advocate of don't save for anything. By the time you can save enough money, the price has gone up.

 

[CXRAndy]

EV Government rebate has been reduced yesterday to £1500, down from £2500. .

Government surprised by the speed of EV take-up, so cost cuttings are being made.

My first EV I got £5000
Subsequent one all been £3.5k

Hurry hurry before its all gone

 

[icowden]

EV Government rebate has been reduced yesterday to £1500, down from £2500. .
Government surprised by the speed of EV take-up, so cost cuttings are being made.

That thing we wanted you to do... we didn't think you would actually do it....

 

[Illaveago]

What would be wrong with that. 180 mile journey is 3 to 3.5 hours. A couple of hours into the journey, stop, have cup of tea, pop to the loo. Car ready and more importantly you're refreshed to be alert

A journey up to Yorkshire in a petrol drive car takes 4.5 hrs with a stop at Leicester Forrest .
The new presenter on Fifth Gear gave some interesting figures . I think she was driving a Kia or Hyundai EV range over 300molrs yet she was saying that you have your eye constantly on the charge gauge . She went on to cover domestic charging times . A conventional charge from home on a flat battery to full would take 28hours. The programme featured some electric city cars . An electric Mini . I think the range was 100+ , not sure of exact figures . Charging time from 20% to 80% charge 36 minutes . Now if we were to go for a car like that we would get to Gloucester and charge . 36 mins . Leicester charge ,36 mins . Sheffield 36 mins + 4.5 hours minimum . That is if the charging points were free.

 

[figbat]

Also the £350 grant for home charger installation stops in March ‘22. Even if you don’t have an EV now it may be worth thinking about getting one now for the future.

 

[CXRAndy]

A journey up to Yorkshire in a petrol drive car takes 4.5 hrs with a stop at Leicester Forrest .
The new presenter on Fifth Gear gave some interesting figures . I think she was driving a Kia or Hyundai EV range over 300molrs yet she was saying that you have your eye constantly on the charge gauge . She went on to cover domestic charging times . A conventional charge from home on a flat battery to full would take 28hours. The programme featured some electric city cars . An electric Mini . I think the range was 100+ , not sure of exact figures . Charging time from 20% to 80% charge 36 minutes . Now if we were to go for a car like that we would get to Gloucester and charge . 36 mins . Leicester charge ,36 mins . Sheffield 36 mins + 4.5 hours minimum . That is if the charging points were free.

My daughter has gone to Edinburgh from our home. One way journey 360 miles. She set off in the Model 3, stopped around Darlington on the A1. 25mins charging to 90%. They went sightseeing in Durham Arrived in Edinburgh later in the afternoon. They popped into Tesla Dealer, charge up to 90% 20mins and then parked car in hotel. The first stop was a chance to have a coffee, loo and stretch legs.

So one additional stop of 20 mins- however they will be ready to drive home at the end of their stay with a circa 90% charge, Probably stop at Darlington on return.

 

[Illaveago]

My daughter has gone to Edinburgh from our home. One way journey 360 miles. She set off in the Model 3, stopped around Darlington on the A1. 25mins charging to 90%. They went sightseeing in Durham Arrived in Edinburgh later in the afternoon. They popped into Tesla Dealer, charge up to 90% 20mins and then parked car in hotel. The first stop was a chance to have a coffee, loo and stretch legs.

So one additional stop of 20 mins- however they will be ready to drive home at the end of their stay with a circa 90% charge, Probably stop at Darlington on return.

Not everyone can afford £43,000 for a used Tesla 3 . That is about all I can find price wise . I do not see new prices .

 

[icowden]

Not everyone can afford £43,000 for a used Tesla 3 . That is about all I can find price wise . I do not see new prices .

A new one will cost you £42,990 for the single motor model. That used Model 3 is likely to be the Long Range version which starts at £49,990.
You can achieve similar distance and stops with other BEVS. You might need to stop a bit longer, or plan an extra stop if you pick something with very short range but most models achieve 200+ miles. So starting from home fully charged, one stop.

You don't need to constantly have your eye on the charge gauge any more than you need to be constantly looking at the fuel gauge on an ICE car. The Fifth Gear presenter clearly wasn't used to electric cars. Almost all models will tell you when you are getting low and will help route you to an available charge point.

A conventional charge from home would take you 28 hours but only if you were plugging into a 240v socket. If you have a charge port fitted, then charging will be considerably quicker. In any event a "full" charge isn't necessarily needed. EVs charge in a graded manner with the middle part of the charge being the quickest. They then downscale the charging pace as they get closer to full.

Yes, if you go for a Mini they aren't designed to go long range. They have about 100 miles of range in normal use. A petrol Mini has about 200 miles of range. A VW ID3 or leaf E+ is probably a better car for longer journeys whilst still being affordable compared to a Model 3.

Prices will drop over time

 

[figbat]

A new one will cost you £42,990 for the single motor model. That used Model 3 is likely to be the Long Range version which starts at £49,990.
You can achieve similar distance and stops with other BEVS. You might need to stop a bit longer, or plan an extra stop if you pick something with very short range but most models achieve 200+ miles. So starting from home fully charged, one stop.

You don't need to constantly have your eye on the charge gauge any more than you need to be constantly looking at the fuel gauge on an ICE car. The Fifth Gear presenter clearly wasn't used to electric cars. Almost all models will tell you when you are getting low and will help route you to an available charge point.

A conventional charge from home would take you 28 hours but only if you were plugging into a 240v socket. If you have a charge port fitted, then charging will be considerably quicker. In any event a "full" charge isn't necessarily needed. EVs charge in a graded manner with the middle part of the charge being the quickest. They then downscale the charging pace as they get closer to full.

Yes, if you go for a Mini they aren't designed to go long range. They have about 100 miles of range in normal use. A petrol Mini has about 200 miles of range. A VW ID3 or leaf E+ is probably a better car for longer journeys whilst still being affordable compared to a Model 3.

Prices will drop over time

I’m normally in agreement with your analyses but I can say from experience that my petrol MINI got 350-380 miles from a ‘charge’ (my electric MINI gets the 100 you state). But the point is that I rarely drove my petrol MINI over 100 miles in one go and so far my electric one has taken me everywhere I have needed it to.