Best stem for comfort

[S-Express]

"The study made minimal reference to blade/fork shape."

The study tested forks of varying shapes and materials, as I said. Regardless of whether it referred to them specifically or not. You can see which forks were tested by looking at the charts.

 

[bozmandb9]

Yeah, I've also got lots of experience, both as a rider and a coach, but that's irrelevant, as is yours. I'm not into saying stuff like "I must be right because I'm experienced" - I would rather rely on empirical evidence. So I'm interested to understand what evidence you have which suggests that cycling does not tax the core muscles in acordance with the demand placed upon them. I'm also interested to understand why the exercise undertaken by the core while cycling, is not enough for cycling? I'm also interested to understand your thought process behind your claim that a better core improves power delivery?

Finally, I'm still not clear what you mean by your statement "most of us have pretty poor core strength". Poor in relation to what? Can you enlarge on that?

What I mean is poor in relation to optimal. It is my opinion, that most of us, whilst we may be 'competent' cyclists, are cycling in a way which is far from optimal, and this is why we may encounter aches and pains, and injuries. I find the same with runners, or those who do not exercise.

Modern lifestyle tends to lead to poor core strength, poor in relation to what it 'should' be, and in relation to what would be optimal.

To give you a different example, let's look at the squat, which is one of the basic moves I asses in new clients. In most people it is extremely limited in range, and demonstrates massive quad dominance (look for knees tracking forwards over the toes). An elite athlete should be able to squat to very low, and will be excellent at performing a balanced squat, keeping back straight, using quads glutes, and hamstrings. A more real life example of this is in children. 'Fresh from the box', children will squat to sit. As they get older, and get used to sitting on chairs, they lose this ability. In indigenous cultures, where they do not have chairs, this doesn't happen.

So equally, the poor core strength, is by comparison to what it should be, if we were active for most of the day, rather than sitting. The relevance to the OP, is this: When riding a bike, you will do one of two things with your weight distribution. Ideally, when cycling, your 'core' i.e. your postural, inner abdominal muscles, and lower back muscles, will be doing a great job of holding your upper body weight (obviously not all). To the extent to which you have sub-optimal core strength, your weight will transfer forwards, through your arms, to your hands. This is far from ideal for bike handling, with too much forward weight bias (especially on descents), and puts enormous pressure on the hands, leading to carpal tunnel syndrome, I attach a link from British Cycling below, in which, although they don't specifically concur with my opinion, they state that it is due to 'excessive pressure' on the hands.
https://www.britishcycling.org.uk/k...he-Experts--Hand-and-wrist-pain-on-the-bike-0

Edited to add, sorry but I really don't have time, to now also explain why applying force through a lever works better from a stable platform, but hope that you can figure our from these few words the answer to your question about power delivery.

 

[S-Express]

What I mean is poor in relation to optimal. It is my opinion, that most of us, whilst we may be 'competent' cyclists, are cycling in a way which is far from optimal, and this is why we may encounter aches and pains, and injuries. I find the same with runners, or those who do not exercise.

Anyone new to cycling, with 'sub-optimal' core strength* for cycling, simply needs to cycle regularly and they will gain optimal core strength for cycling....by cycling. Obviously if someone has a diagnosed weakness or deficiency in one or more areas of their core structure, then additional weights or exercise regimes might be appropriate. But someone with 'normal' ability just needs to get on and ride.

* personally, I doubt if anyone's core strength is actually 'sub-optimal', because it is merely 'optimal' for whatever it is they do - even if they don't do very much

 

[Ajax Bay]

What I mean is poor in relation to optimal. It is my opinion, that most of us, whilst we may be 'competent' cyclists, are cycling in a way which is far from optimal, and this is why we may encounter aches and pains, and injuries. I find the same with runners, or those who do not exercise. Modern lifestyle tends to lead to poor core strength, poor in relation to what it 'should' be, and in relation to what would be optimal.

Anyone new to cycling, with 'sub-optimal' core strength* for cycling, simply needs to cycle regularly and they will gain optimal core strength for cycling....by cycling.

Simply cycling, same as 'simply running' is a simplistic approach. A 'normal' rider may gain some (but nowhere near optimal) core strength by simply cycling regularly but would gain it more effectively by targeted gym/floor exercises. @bozmandb9 clearly has expertise in this area and I agree with him, drawing on my previous decent level running experience. All sportsmen and women would be well advised to add (or substitute if necessary) core strength work to their training programme, from an early age. It is so attractive not so to do - "I just love running/cycling, I don't want to 'waste' time in the gym".

People may 'get away' with not doing this for ages, especially if they follow several sports which exercise a wider range of muscles, but in due course, poor core strength will catch up with you, and likely injury will follow injury: the body is so interlinked. DAMHIK I thoroughly encourage young men/women like @S-Express and the OP who want to cycle further/longer/faster, and even those old enough for a Senior Railcard, to adopt a plan of core strength training, as well as getting out on their bike.

 

[RedRider]

This is better than The Gossage—Vardebedian Papers

 

[S-Express]

I thoroughly encourage young men/women like @S-Express

First things first - I'm flattered you think I'm 'young'... I've been racing/training for more than 20 years years now, and coaching for the last 5 years or so Anyway...

A 'normal' rider may gain some (but nowhere near optimal) core strength by simply cycling regularly but would gain it more effectively by targeted gym/floor exercises

Cycling develops the core sufficiently to enable cycling - same as it does for all the other muscles used while cycling. There's nothing special about the 'core' which means it behaves differently and responds differently to stimulus than any other muscle in the human body - if it did, scientists would have written papers on it. Your argument implies that it is not possible to ride a bike effectively without undertaking some gym work first, which is nonsense, obviously.

but in due course, poor core strength will catch up with you, and likely injury will follow injury:

Unless you have any evidence for this, I'm going to call this as alarmist nonsense. As I said before, a deficient core may require intervention. but, as far as I'm aware, the principal causes of non-accidental injuries in cycling are down to things like poor bike fit and over-use/over-reaching to do more/harder cycling than a rider is capable of at the time. Poor bike fit can give you problems in the core area, potentially - but it is not the fault of the core - it is the fault of poor bike fit.

Seriously, why do people think that the 'core' is so fundamentally different to every other muscle group, that it behaves differently when exercised? You exercise a muscle and it then adapts to the demands placed on it.

 

[Ajax Bay]

Your argument implies that it is not possible to ride a bike effectively without undertaking some gym work first, which is nonsense, obviously.

Your inference is nonsense: please re-read what I said and seek to comprehend it. Please also note that I said "gym/floor exercises". These can easily be done at home, or outdoors - don't want these essential exercises to be tarred with the 'in a gym' brush.
What about extracting and showing the people you coach @bozmandb9 's comment, your response and mine, so they can see what some people (not you) think about core strength?

 

[Sharky]

First things first - I'm flattered you think I'm 'young'... I've been racing/training for more than 20 years years now, and coaching for the last 5 years or so Anyway...

Only 20 years - you must be young - or started late.
Cheers Keith

 

[S-Express]

Only 20 years

I said 'more than' - I was being modest.

 

[S-Express]

What about extracting and showing the people you coach @bozmandb9 's comment, your response and mine, so they can see what some people (not you) think about core strength?

Doing that would be giving them incorrect information, in my view. All you have to do in order to correct me is offer evidence that:

a) cycling itself is not sufficient in order to develop the core for cycling
b) 'non-optimal' core strength is a major cause of cycling injuries and poor fit and over-reaching are not the principal cause of non-impact related cycling injuries
c) the 'core' muscles are somehow different in their response to exercise stimulus, when compared to every other muscle in the human body.

Good luck with that.

I'm not against core work as such, I just don't like reading nonsense like 'you need a strong core to cycle'. Obviously, as I have said before - if you have some kind of pre-existing condition, or if you want to do core work for any other reasons other than cycling, then feel free. It's certainly not harmful, providing the time spent exercising your core does not eat into time spent improving your aerobic capacity, threshold or VO2 max.

 

[dim]

I think that the OP is totally confused now ... his question was:

I am building up a new road bike and currently researching my seatpost, bars and stem. However there seems to be very little information on which stems are best for soaking up road buzz. Anyone for any recommendations or come acrosss any tests?

now people are telling him to do core strength exercises, yoya, pilates, push ups, sit ups and squats

 

[S-Express]

now people are telling him to do core strength exercises, yoya, pilates, push ups, sit ups and squats

daft, isn't it.

 

[bozmandb9]

daft, isn't it.

Yes, I must be really stupid to think that slumping on the bike, because of weak postural muscles, could have any relationship to pain through the hands. I think I need to get British Cycling to re-write some of their training manuals too.

Think I'll cancel all my PT clients, and cycle coaching courses, and tell everybody they can get all the expertise from armchair experts through t'interweb, who repeatedly demand evidence, whilst offering none. I'm out now. You know what they say about 'you can argue with an ....'

 

[S-Express]

Yes, I must be really stupid to think that slumping on the bike, because of weak postural muscles, could have any relationship to pain through the hands. I think I need to get British Cycling to re-write some of their training manuals too.

Think I'll cancel all my PT clients, and cycle coaching courses, and tell everybody they can get all the expertise from armchair experts through t'interweb, who repeatedly demand evidence, whilst offering none. I'm out now. You know what they say about 'you can argue with an ....'

Or alternatively, you could leave aside all your silly 'appeals to authority' and just answer all the points like I asked you. I've explained rationally and logically why I think core strength is not as important for cycling as you seem to think it is. You, on the other hand, claim it is something which must be addressed, while offering no physiological explanation which stands up to even the most moderate scrutiny. A true armchair expert is one who can't support his assertions. I did, now it's your turn.

 

[dim]

Yes, I must be really stupid to think that slumping on the bike, because of weak postural muscles, could have any relationship to pain through the hands. I think I need to get British Cycling to re-write some of their training manuals too.

Think I'll cancel all my PT clients, and cycle coaching courses, and tell everybody they can get all the expertise from armchair experts through t'interweb, who repeatedly demand evidence, whilst offering none. I'm out now. You know what they say about 'you can argue with an ....'