Box junction fines

[classic33]

That's not Bertie!

 

[Piemaster]

Just sometimes we should try and get the law changed.

For example, driving in a bus lane during operation is likely to result in a ticket if caught. I agree with this, it protects bus passengers, taxis, cyclists etc. (whoever is permitted to use it).

However, I believe that overtaking vehicles turning right should be permitted in bus lanes. And actually a number of councils do build this into the bus lane traffic orders. Hull haven't, and now they're installing bus lane cameras - the result is that you get a road, with two lanes, the left a bus lane, the right a normal lane. A car in the normal lane needs to turn right and can't, so you have nothing in front of it, but nothing can move! Ridiculous, and bad for the environment. If the bus lane was busy, I would say it's fine, as at least that lane is moving and doing what it is designed to do, but I submitted a FOI request and how many buses were expected to use this bus lane in the hours of its operation? 6, in 2.5 hours.

Sometimes a bit of common sense is needed.

No. Because people are idiots and don't possess any common sense. What will actually happen is several vehicles, not just the one or two there is space for, will try to pass a right turning vehicle, resulting in a queue forming in the bus lane around it and blocking both lanes anyway. It's exactly the same reason why cameras are fitted to monitor box junctions.
I'll assume you're from Hull. Junction @ Beverley Road / Clough Road. Where I had to sit with a ever increasing queue of traffic behind me for a full cycle of the lights due to the idiots who thought it was ok to block the junction when turning right into Cottingham road. A place where cameras might actually stop it happening.

And anyway, why would you want cars in bus lanes? Just peddle past the queues in them smiling.

 

[TheDoctor]

Box junction fines, like those for speeding, bus lane violations and the like, are a tax upon stupidity.
Don't like it? The solution is in your own hands!

 

[Drago]

If they don't pay they seize the car and sell them at auction. If thousand suddenly didn't pay they'd just seize thousands of cars.

 

[BrynCP]

No. Because people are idiots and don't possess any common sense.

The problem with that is the bus lane on Spring Bank west between Chanterland's Avenue and Spring Bank. You get cars trying to turn right down Sunny Bank, and nothing can progress. There are next to no buses using that bus lane either.

So if you had an aerial view, you'd just see a big stretch of empty road. I get what you're saying about idiots just following the cars in front though.

I would say the common sense here ought to have been never to create a bus lane here in the first place - the buses get stuck down Chanterland's avenue towards the end because the normal traffic can't turn left because all the cars on spring bank west are stuck behind somebody turning right!

I'll assume you're from Hull.

Yes, and I know that junction well and agree. The worst box junction for me used to be on Anlaby road between St George Road and Albert Avenue. Everybody, including buses, would block it. I used to go this way to avoid the flyover, because everybody used to cheat on the bus lane there, wrongly, meaning law abiders like myself would get caught on the right hand turn (to Walton Street) lane with nobody letting me into "their" lane to go straight ahead, and the cars behind me wanting to go to Walton Street annoyed I hadn't just gone into the bus lane with the other 100 cars.

And anyway, why would you want cars in bus lanes? Just peddle past the queues in them smiling.

I drive to work.

 

[Piemaster]

@BrynCP Yup, know those junctions. Ugh. Was it a couple of years ago? Council seemed to be doing it's best to dig up most major roads in West Hull - I was convinced they were trying for a moat. I'm fortunate in that I rarely have to deal with peak time traffic and my wife walks to work, you have my condolences.
Can't wait for the Castle Street upgrade.

 

[Shut Up Legs]

...its time people stood up and said enough is enough.

Yes, enough is enough: I'm fed up with people not keeping junctions clear, and then whining about being fined for doing it.

 

[BrynCP]

Can't wait for the Castle Street upgrade.

I work just near Castle Street, I cannot not be affected by this

Perhaps a good time to think about cycling! It's only about 4 miles, but provision of decent showers was my concern. In fact, exploiting the bus lanes on Beverley road then the cycle paths along Greenwood avenue, it could be quite a safe, quick journey!

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

what is a box junction?

Think of an array of yellow saltires.

 

[Arch]

I work just near Castle Street, I cannot not be affected by this

Perhaps a good time to think about cycling! It's only about 4 miles, but provision of decent showers was my concern. In fact, exploiting the bus lanes on Beverley road then the cycle paths along Greenwood avenue, it could be quite a safe, quick journey!

I cycle 5 miles and don't need a shower. Just don't thrash along like you're in a race and ease off for the last half mile. If you do feel a bit sweaty when you get in, a wipe down with a baby wipe or two in the toilet will do.

 

[snorri]

I wonder if Ludwig had been socialising last night?
Provocative post at 23.30 on a Saturday, just saying

 

[Beebo]

I got caught in the box junction in the Catford one way system. £60 fine!
But in my defence the roads were grid locked and by the nature of the junction I had no choice to enter the box in order to progress.
If I hadnt entered the junction the cars joining to my left would have just kept filling the empty space. Sometime when driving in London you have no choice but to be a bit forceful.

 

[CopperCyclist]

No. Because people are idiots and don't possess any common sense. What will actually happen is several vehicles, not just the one or two there is space for, will try to pass a right turning vehicle, resulting in a queue forming in the bus lane around it and blocking both lanes anyway. It's exactly the same reason why cameras are fitted to monitor box junctions.
I'll assume you're from Hull. Junction @ Beverley Road / Clough Road. Where I had to sit with a ever increasing queue of traffic behind me for a full cycle of the lights due to the idiots who thought it was ok to block the junction when turning right into Cottingham road. A place where cameras might actually stop it happening.

And anyway, why would you want cars in bus lanes? Just peddle past the queues in them smiling.

The problem would be solved if you allowed the user of the bus lane to pass the stationary vehicle, but painted a box junction on top of the bus lane to prevent people entering it if their exit was blocked.

Oh hang on...

 

[twentysix by twentyfive]

I work just near Castle Street, I cannot not be affected by this

Perhaps a good time to think about cycling! It's only about 4 miles, but provision of decent showers was my concern. In fact, exploiting the bus lanes on Beverley road then the cycle paths along Greenwood avenue, it could be quite a safe, quick journey!

@Arch has said it. Just don't get hot. In 4 miles it shouldn't be a problem. You'll feel better and save dosh. For me it's a no brainer - especially with the apparent traffic chaos. Just pedal past it all with a grin

 

[Over The Hill]

We all have the highway code. The Highway Code does not impose a fine for stopping in a box junction.

Now if park on a road I can see the road restrictions in a sign or if I park in a council car park I can see they impose a fine if I don't pay a parking fee. Congestion charge area is well signed and some effort is made to make drivers aware of it.

So then how do I know that if I happen to be in some area where the local authority impose such fines? If I am not made aware of their special rule how am I to know to be liable?

Is it not like using a public loo and then on the way out someone says "that will be £5" - pay or we take you to court.