Bus driver jailed

[classic33]

What would be the response on here if someone on a bike, using a shared cyclepath(pedestrians & cyclist with equal right to be there) decided after an argument with a pedestrian, ran him/her down. Bike is then used as a weapon.

Part of the problem with the clip is that we only saw the end result, not what led up to that result. Someone must have alerted the police. They had a car on scene whilst the cyclist was still rolling on the ground after being hit. Have read some of the comments on various sites & they put it down to an altercation between the driver & cyclist the day before & on the day. Which is correct?

There's a layby to the left of the cyclist, was he expecting it to go there, stop & have the driver come after him. Both may just explain his move to the right. Doesn't explain his cycling upto that point though.

I'll not make excuses for either driver or cyclist, both will have to accept blame for what happenned. However what would have been the outcome if the cyclist had aimed his bike at the bus?

Bus driver got off lightly in my opinion.

 

[vernon]

It's being actively discussed over in the commuting forum

 

[Francesca]

okies

 

[al78]

I think that demonstrates the gulf between cyclists and other road users. As someone who is forced to ride a bike by mere poverty I can only wonder if anyone else here ever drives a car and realises just how much of a nuisance cyclists can be. Not as much of a nuisance as buses of course, not even close, but as soft targets go we're up there with coke cans and pensioners. There is also the simple jealousy provoked by all that red light jumping (what do you mean you don't?? lol) and the occasionally overbearing air of smugness which Lycra will always generate.

Er no, I'd have to disagree that pensioners are viewed anywhere near as negatively as cyclists are, quite the opposite in fact. I can guarantee that if someone assaulted an OAP after a previous altercation virtually everyone (excluding obvious trolls) would be condemning the attacker.

 

[MacB]

I'm not suggesting that the concept should be normalised, that would be a sad day if that were ever true. I am however suggesting that if you shove your face into someone elses then they may not react in what people in polite society would consider a reasonable manner. As Norm said, it's a case of considering the consequences. My take on it is that the more extreme my reaction to a situation may be, the more extreme the consequences of my reactions may be.
As I said previously, that doesn't mean I believe that we do nothing, I don't believe we lie down and accept close passes or abuse or what ever else is thrown at us (sometimes literally) but I do think that if you get to the stage where you've leant your bike against the front of a bus to have a go at the driver then maybe you've gone a little far, and you may be well advised to stand on the pavement for a couple of minutes to cool down.

I don't think we're in disagreement but I think I'm maybe building a bigger mental picture around this than I need to. I'm just seeing a trend, across lots of areas, for normalisation of excessive, or previously unacceptable, behaviours. Think of things like the adoption of the term 'road rage' and how it's just become another term for a regular occurrence. The same can be extrapolated out across business, policing, military action...in fact all walks of life. Things that may once have 'shocked the nation' now don't get beyond regional newspapers, or don't get seriously reported at all.

I could run a long way with this idea but I don't think this is the thread for it.

 

[lulubel]

While I totally accept the bus driver was in the wrong, and I think he should be in prison for a lot longer, and for attempted murder, I also think the cyclist has himself to blame for what happened in the sense that he could have avoided it by not winding up the bus driver in the first place. (I can use the same argument to say I have myself to blame for my accident last Sunday because I didn't assume the driver was going to pull out in front of me at the roundabout. I could have avoided it happening by being more cautious, and I'm going to make sure I am more cautious in future.)

Regardless of who is right or wrong, we are the ones who are vulnerable on the roads, not bus or even car drivers. Just because drivers shouldn't use their vehicles as weapons against us doesn't mean they never do. It's up to each of us as individuals to assess the level of risk and decide what consequences we're willing to accept. For me, that means I want to conclude my ride by walking in through my front door, not being carried into the hospital - or the morgue - on a stretcher, and I will do everything within my power to accomplish that, including letting an aggressive driver "get away" with his behaviour if it means he leaves me alone.

That doesn't mean I won't report dangerous driving to the police, or I won't speak to a driver about a close pass if I get the opportunity, but I'd handle it a lot differently. I wouldn't go beyond going up to the passenger door when the bus is next at a stop and saying something like, "You got a bit close to me back there, mate." If his response was aggressive, I'd back away and wait until he was gone before I carried on with my journey, then report him to the police or his employer. For me, anything more than that wouldn't be worth the risk.

That isn't letting the cycling community down, or letting drivers know that bad behaviour is acceptable. It's simple self-preservation.

 

[400bhp]

While I totally accept the bus driver was in the wrong, and I think he should be in prison for a lot longer, and for attempted murder, I also think the cyclist has himself to blame for what happened in the sense that he could have avoided it by not winding up the bus driver in the first place. (I can use the same argument to say I have myself to blame for my accident last Sunday because I didn't assume the driver was going to pull out in front of me at the roundabout. I could have avoided it happening by being more cautious, and I'm going to make sure I am more cautious in future.)

You have to be careful when using reasoning like that, as it is risk removal rather than risk mitigation. What I mean by that is the only safe outcome is not to cycle.

I agree with the rest of your post and at the end of the day you are right-on paper-in the real world with a human element there will be altercations with motorists.

 

[lulubel]

You have to be careful when using reasoning like that, as it is risk removal rather than risk mitigation. What I mean by that is the only safe outcome is not to cycle.

One of the first things I was asked to do on my advanced driving course was to look at some accidents and think about what the "non-fault" driver could have done to avoid them. It was a real eye-opener, and when I did the same to my crash, I concluded that entering the roundabout just 3-4mph slower might have given me the extra time I needed to read the driver's behaviour better and predict his actions. Since I was out for a pleasant Sunday ride, not a race, I don't think that would have been much of a hardship.

I rode horses until my mid-20s (when I had to start renting my own place and couldn't afford to any more) and falling off and getting hurt is a given, so I'm not into trying to eliminate risk, but I've found that small changes in behaviour can mean big reductions in risk.

 

[Chuffy]

While I totally accept the bus driver was in the wrong, and I think he should be in prison for a lot longer, and for attempted murder, I also think the cyclist has himself to blame for what happened in the sense that he could have avoided it by not winding up the bus driver in the first place. (I can use the same argument to say I have myself to blame for my accident last Sunday because I didn't assume the driver was going to pull out in front of me at the roundabout. I could have avoided it happening by being more cautious, and I'm going to make sure I am more cautious in future.)

fark. RIGHT. OFF.

Will translate this into something easier to understand if necessary.

 

[lulubel]

****. RIGHT. OFF.

Will translate this into something easier to understand if necessary.

Don't be such an idiot.

 

[Mugshot]

****. RIGHT. OFF.

Will translate this into something easier to understand if necessary.

I'd love to see a translation if you don't mind

 

[BigonaBianchi]

This doesnt surprise me in th eleast, I see bus drivers fuming in a blood red haze all th etime jus tbecause they dont like cyclists..the guy cleary deliberatly tried to kill the cyclist with his bus..that is attempted murder...arsewipe of the lowest order.

 

[BigonaBianchi]

it even got a mention on a recording forum in the states...a cyber mate of mine posted about it over there...good to see this low life being spread across the globe, even if not literally.

 

[dawesome]

Your views are strange and deplorable lulubell, you're using the same argument crusty old judges use when they say a girl deserved to be raped for wearing make up.

 

[Mugshot]

Your views are strange and deplorable lulubell, you're using the same argument crusty old judges use when they say a girl deserved to be raped for wearing make up.

You know, I was tootling to work yesterday and I was having a think about this thread, and I wondered how long it would be before somebody threw this into the mix, thank you for not disappointing me dawsome