Bye Bye Bye .......... Delilah

[ufkacbln]

[QUOTE 4143998, member: 45"]Don't be ridiculous. Apart from that sentence not making sense, getting angry is not a medical condition which excuses someone from murder.[/QUOTE]
As above, there is legal precedent for both men and women where such a crime has been seen as a reason and the. Mental health of the individual taken into account

 

[User482]

I wonder if we would have the same fuss if the gender roles were reversed and the miscreant in the song was a woman who found her husband being unfaithful and killed by a female

We wouldn't: the fuss would be far greater.

 

[ufkacbln]

"Such a crime has been seen as a reason"? Infidelity is a crime?

Back to the original song?

Provocation is (as I understand it), and unlesss it has changed is an offense in English common law

I was referring to this and not the infidelity on its own

 

[ufkacbln]

Infidelity used to be a crime.... but hasn't been for almost three centuries in the UK. It seems Cunobelin is hankering for a bygone age...

Adultery is still a crime in about 20 US states.

See above, it is nothing to do with adultery or infidelity being illegal.


However....
In them days there was the offence of "Petty Treason"

High Treason could only be perpetrated against a Monarch

However each individual had their place in teh heirarchy, and killing someone above your station was a threat to the stability of the Society

A wife killing her husband, junior clergy killing a senior member of clergy, or a servant killing one of their master's family

The penalty for Petty Treason was the same as for High Treason....

Hung drawn and quartered if male, and burnt at the stake if female

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

So, should the song be banned then - that's what the OP is about after all?

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

Do try and keep up. Claud answered that one ages ago.

Ah, clearly I misread

The shadow leader of the House of Commons, Chris Bryant, has joined calls for the Tom Jones song Delilah to no longer be sung at Six Nations rugby matches because he claims it glorifies violence against women.

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

I wouldn't ban it, we've seen in Scotland that banning songs is unenforceable.

It would be a good idea to have a sensible discussion about domestic abuse, recognising that abuse takes a wide variety of forms and that physical violence against women forms only a small part of this. Far more prevalent is mental and verbal abuse which is most certainly a two-way street. We should be looking at why people feel forced to stay in abusive relationships, what can we do to make it easier for people to walk away from such relationships yet maintain financial security and rights of access to children.

Still - "Delilah", m'baaad mkaay

 

[PhilDawson8270]

Are all songs about murder bad? All artistic work about violence bad?

 

[ufkacbln]

Oh - so you've moved from your claim that infidelity was a crime to petty treason...

Here's some more straws for your to clutch at

Read the post?

There are two different replies

I have never claimed that infidelity was illegal.... The offence I described was the sum of the actions in the song, provocation which as explained above is illegal in common law

The second was a reply to your suggestions of a bygone age.

 

[ufkacbln]

You were suggesting that a partner being unfaithful might be enough to affect someone's mental health to the extent that they could justifiably kill the unfaithful person. I'm not sure why you felt it was necessary to suggest this, when the situation in the song is exactly as described by Adrian:

Because the sad fact is that it is a defence that has been successfully used to avoid a murder charge, the words of the song state this :

As she deceived me I watched and went out of my mind
My, my, my, Delilah

If you have an alternative explanation of "went out of my mind", given the legal precedents, it would be interesting

 

[PhilDawson8270]

Because the sad fact is that it is a defence that has been successfully used to avoid a murder charge, the words of the song state this :

The song also has the lyrics:

So before they come to break down the door
Forgive me Delilah I just couldn't take any more

Pretty much an acknowledgement of the crime, and that what he (the fictional character) did was wrong.

 

[ufkacbln]

That provocation being infidelity. Which isn't illegal.

Neither's provocation (unless the provoking act is itself an offence which - just to make double sure as you appear to have a problem grasping this fact - adultery isn't) but it may be taken into account in mitigation.

Again read the posts


You are the one who seems to be unable to grasp that no one has stated that adultery or infidelity is illegal

It is the COMBINED act of infidelity and then taunting the person about it

That has been recognised in common law

Whether you wish to ignore that fact and continue to leave out the key second component is entirely up to you

 

[ufkacbln]

Oh do leave off you silly man. It's a song.

Which you chose to go into a long post with a personal interpretation of a number of possible meanings?

 

[ufkacbln]

You have. Twice. If that's not what you meant, then perhaps you should write a little more clearly...



That is not a criminal offence. If you believe it is then provide some evidence. A reference to the legislation... or even a case law reference or two (OSCOLA referencing, natch).

You mean like the Public Order act 1986?

 

[ufkacbln]

OK.... what part of the Public Order Act 1986 criminalises infidelity and taunting someone about it then (you've claimed both aspects are criminalised)? You must be able to quote the exact section...

Until you read what is actually written.......

What is your problem with the word "COMBINED"