Can e-bikes really work?

[ericmark]

The report from the BBC seems to show e-bikes as a really good option, however I know my e-bike will only get me the last 1/4 mile home with a lot of manual effort.

There is a minimum speed on a bike in real terms, below 4 MPH balance becomes hard, and the motor starts to loose torque, wife's mid engine where it drives through the gears maybe 3 MPH but at 22 stone, the 250 watt motor to put it simply is not enough to allow me to cycle these Welsh hills.

The other problem is safety, the only way out of the village is the A458, a fast winding road, which although easy enough with an e-bike, means one it doing 16 MPH on a busy road.

The railway only runs to Welshpool in the summer, and this last session it has been only one train the Welshpool and back, the rest stop at Castle, so about 1 hour max between getting in Welshpool and returning. And the Golfa bank out of Welshpool is a hard slog.

I can beat the train with my e-bike, but for how long, at 70 I am slowing down, and to be able to cycle around here looking for around 500 watt not 250 watt, I am sure if I weighed 12 stone 250 watt would be enough, however if I weighed 12 stone then riding a bike would not be so important. My e-bike will just about do the return trip Welshpool and back, 16 miles it not far.

I tried once to do Shrewsbury to Welshpool using google maps, I did not make it, the last couple of mile was pedal power only, that is with a 12 Ah 48 volt battery.

 

[jowwy]

The report from the BBC seems to show e-bikes as a really good option, however I know my e-bike will only get me the last 1/4 mile home with a lot of manual effort.

There is a minimum speed on a bike in real terms, below 4 MPH balance becomes hard, and the motor starts to loose torque, wife's mid engine where it drives through the gears maybe 3 MPH but at 22 stone, the 250 watt motor to put it simply is not enough to allow me to cycle these Welsh hills.

The other problem is safety, the only way out of the village is the A458, a fast winding road, which although easy enough with an e-bike, means one it doing 16 MPH on a busy road.

The railway only runs to Welshpool in the summer, and this last session it has been only one train the Welshpool and back, the rest stop at Castle, so about 1 hour max between getting in Welshpool and returning. And the Golfa bank out of Welshpool is a hard slog.

I can beat the train with my e-bike, but for how long, at 70 I am slowing down, and to be able to cycle around here looking for around 500 watt not 250 watt, I am sure if I weighed 12 stone 250 watt would be enough, however if I weighed 12 stone then riding a bike would not be so important. My e-bike will just about do the return trip Welshpool and back, 16 miles it not far.

I tried once to do Shrewsbury to Welshpool using google maps, I did not make it, the last couple of mile was pedal power only, that is with a 12 Ah 48 volt battery.

Im circa 19stone plus….i have an ebike that has 250watt motor, and 500wh battery, i can do 30mile round trip to work, with 1500ft of climbing and still have 2bars of battery left.

 

[steveindenmark]

My Moustache Friday 28.7 has a 250w motor and 500wh battery. In eco mode, which is plenty enough, it will do about 120km.

 

[a.twiddler]

The report from the BBC seems to show e-bikes as a really good option, however I know my e-bike will only get me the last 1/4 mile home with a lot of manual effort.

There is a minimum speed on a bike in real terms, below 4 MPH balance becomes hard, and the motor starts to loose torque, wife's mid engine where it drives through the gears maybe 3 MPH but at 22 stone, the 250 watt motor to put it simply is not enough to allow me to cycle these Welsh hills.

The other problem is safety, the only way out of the village is the A458, a fast winding road, which although easy enough with an e-bike, means one it doing 16 MPH on a busy road.

The railway only runs to Welshpool in the summer, and this last session it has been only one train the Welshpool and back, the rest stop at Castle, so about 1 hour max between getting in Welshpool and returning. And the Golfa bank out of Welshpool is a hard slog.

I can beat the train with my e-bike, but for how long, at 70 I am slowing down, and to be able to cycle around here looking for around 500 watt not 250 watt, I am sure if I weighed 12 stone 250 watt would be enough, however if I weighed 12 stone then riding a bike would not be so important. My e-bike will just about do the return trip Welshpool and back, 16 miles it not far.

I tried once to do Shrewsbury to Welshpool using google maps, I did not make it, the last couple of mile was pedal power only, that is with a 12 Ah 48 volt battery.

Surely more power, apart from being technically illegal, would drain the same size battery faster. How old is your battery? Will your ebike take a higher capacity battery? Even a few more Ah would give some more range, without completely draining the battery each time which as I understand it, doesn't help battery life. Not an ebike owner, though I have thought about it quite a bit from time to time.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Maybe a e-moped will better suit your needs?

 

[CXRAndy]

The report from the BBC seems to show e-bikes as a really good option, however I know my e-bike will only get me the last 1/4 mile home with a lot of manual effort.

There is a minimum speed on a bike in real terms, below 4 MPH balance becomes hard, and the motor starts to loose torque, wife's mid engine where it drives through the gears maybe 3 MPH but at 22 stone, the 250 watt motor to put it simply is not enough to allow me to cycle these Welsh hills.

The other problem is safety, the only way out of the village is the A458, a fast winding road, which although easy enough with an e-bike, means one it doing 16 MPH on a busy road.

The railway only runs to Welshpool in the summer, and this last session it has been only one train the Welshpool and back, the rest stop at Castle, so about 1 hour max between getting in Welshpool and returning. And the Golfa bank out of Welshpool is a hard slog.

I can beat the train with my e-bike, but for how long, at 70 I am slowing down, and to be able to cycle around here looking for around 500 watt not 250 watt, I am sure if I weighed 12 stone 250 watt would be enough, however if I weighed 12 stone then riding a bike would not be so important. My e-bike will just about do the return trip Welshpool and back, 16 miles it not far.

I tried once to do Shrewsbury to Welshpool using google maps, I did not make it, the last couple of mile was pedal power only, that is with a 12 Ah 48 volt battery.

Buy a bike or convert a bike with a Bafang BBS02 motor. This has 750W motor and 100nm torque. Get a 700Whr (14Ah) 48/52 Volt battery.

Then you will have no issues getting up any hill.

If you want more power then BBSHD or M620. These are 1000W 120/160nm motors.

 

[toffee]

Buy a bike or convert a bike with a Bafang BBS02 motor. This has 750W motor and 100nm torque. Get a 700Whr (14Ah) 48/52 Volt battery.

Then you will have no issues getting up any hill.

If you want more power then BBSHD or M620. These are 1000W 120/160nm motors.

But they are illegal

 

[CXRAndy]

But they are illegal

It will allow him to continue riding

Do you believe the latest Bosch, Brose, Yamaha motors with 85Nm are legal. They peak power over 700W.

It's all a smoke screen 250W nominal power.

 

[toffee]

It will allow him to continue riding

Do you believe the latest Bosch, Brose, Yamaha motors with 85Nm are legal. They peak power over 700W.

It's all a smoke screen 250W nominal power.

Put whatever words you want as evidence but they are illegal. Legal ones will also allow him to continue riding

 

[CXRAndy]

We'll that's upto him.

 

[bonzobanana]

Put whatever words you want as evidence but they are illegal. Legal ones will also allow him to continue riding

Well the store bought mid-drive motors seem to be allowed to go high wattage as long as they keep strictly to the 15.5mph assistance limit despite going hugely above the claimed 250W in fact when Bosch motors are sold in other markets with a 350W rating or 28mph top speed the wattage draw remains the same it seems for hill climbing basically Bosch just caps maximum speed on 250W motors. Lets not forget Bosch were heavily involved in providing the technology of the dieselgate scandal and had a spy in Dyson and perhaps some of Bosch products have benefitted from that stolen technology. A pretty vile company by any standard that has no problem operating outside the law it seems.

If someone were to use a 750W Bafang motor but ensure its set to legal assistance speed then realistically it seems unlikely they would be prosecuted. If someone in authority finally realises many of these expensive shop bought mid-drive ebikes are illegal are they just going to scrap them, its quite likely they even know they aren't legal now. Even people outside the EU know the EU legislation is farcical and completely ridiculous in what ebikes are allowed. It's just utterly moronic we use this corrupt EU legislation here in the UK now we are outside the EU. We should have simple logical legislation that provides the best option for consumers and is easy for everyone to understand not use legislation as a way of creating trade barriers and restricting consumers to high cost, high maintenance products.

https://www.ebikeschool.com/myth-ebike-wattage/

 

[CXRAndy]

I believe 500W and 20mph limit is just about perfect. Couple it to a 750Whr 52V battery. Great range, decent speed and enough grunt to aid steep hills.

That would open folk shopping, commuting easily 10-15 miles each way. Just imagine thousands of cars off the road, because folk commuted by ebike/bike from the suburbs of major cities and towns.

Holland/Denmark/Germany do it

 

[roubaixtuesday]

The report from the BBC seems to show e-bikes as a really good option, however I know my e-bike will only get me the last 1/4 mile home with a lot of manual effort.

There is a minimum speed on a bike in real terms, below 4 MPH balance becomes hard, and the motor starts to loose torque, wife's mid engine where it drives through the gears maybe 3 MPH but at 22 stone, the 250 watt motor to put it simply is not enough to allow me to cycle these Welsh hills.

The other problem is safety, the only way out of the village is the A458, a fast winding road, which although easy enough with an e-bike, means one it doing 16 MPH on a busy road.

The railway only runs to Welshpool in the summer, and this last session it has been only one train the Welshpool and back, the rest stop at Castle, so about 1 hour max between getting in Welshpool and returning. And the Golfa bank out of Welshpool is a hard slog.

I can beat the train with my e-bike, but for how long, at 70 I am slowing down, and to be able to cycle around here looking for around 500 watt not 250 watt, I am sure if I weighed 12 stone 250 watt would be enough, however if I weighed 12 stone then riding a bike would not be so important. My e-bike will just about do the return trip Welshpool and back, 16 miles it not far.

I tried once to do Shrewsbury to Welshpool using google maps, I did not make it, the last couple of mile was pedal power only, that is with a 12 Ah 48 volt battery.

What make and model do you have?

As others have indicated, your needs on range and power are probably well within the capabilities on the market.

Being comfortable riding on a main road is another matter.

 

[ericmark]

My wife's bike is mid motor and the 250 watt seems to work well, since it works through the gears, it seems to cope with most of the hills, and the walk assist does work if you can keep finger on the button, however it will not fit on the train in any carriage other than one designed for the disabled, and will only fit on back of car, not inside it, which is a security problem, can't just leave it on back of car when the whole bike rack can be removed and bike stolen.

My bike has motor in the rear wheel, and folds, so can carry on the train on the veranda, and people can still get past it, and the carriage gates can close. I fits boot with one car, and in front of rear seats with other car, seats lifted up, so it is secure if left in the car. It is 350 watt peak, but within the 250 watt on a continuous basis, however below 6 MPH the power seems to drop off, by 4 MPH may as well give up and walk.

As to Gibbet Road B4389 main route to Newtown forget it. The watergate street or New road out of town I can just about do, but the mileage increases, so unlikely I would even get to Newtown never mind back using the direct route. So only real way is through Welshpool, once at Welshpool motor can be turned off, and can follow the canal to Newtown, but without motor speed is reduced, so I would be going at around 7 to 10 MPH rather than 16 MPH doubling the time. Looking at around 22 miles each way through Welshpool, and 12.8 normal car driving route. If the trains are running, then can knock off 8 miles, so can just about do Newtown and back if the train is running. But since Colvid the summer time table has changed, with only one train a day to Welshpool, rest stop at Castle, so left with the Golfa hill, that is for me just about do-able.

Where I use to live in North Wales yes the e-bike was good, also there was a bus service to Chester and Mold from 7 am to 10 pm so no real need for a bike anyway, mothers house in Shotton also train to Wrexham, on my bus pass, so yes the e-bike was good, at one point you could put bike on the bus Mold to Ruthin, I see the racks now gone, but the e-bike did work.

Here in mid Wales however very limited, I did try to ride home from Shrewsbury, got to within 3 miles of Welshpool before battery ran out, not helped as used Google maps bike route, not main road, but had to retire to Pub and await rescue, no way was I going up Golfa without a motor to assist.

 

[CXRAndy]

4mph is, I class wobbly speed. Not really safe to do on busy vehicle used roads