Christies modern art sale

[Tim Hall]

[QUOTE 3160976, member: 1314"]Clue - a male, Londoner, and winner of 2014 Oscar Best Picture![/QUOTE]
Sir! Sir! Was it Steve McQueen? Was it sir?
<jumps up and down excitedly>

 

[Archie_tect]

Should have been Buster Keaton if it was him....

 

[SteCenturion]

was it the house filled with cement, then knocked down to leave only the cement imprinted with details of the house that once surrounded it... whatever it was called, and whoever did it?

edit... no... that was '93... and this is it...

Now, that, on the other hand, took a little thought and a spark of 'something' I won't call genius, but something good.

A thought process that very few would have & quite literally leaves an impression.

Whereas, bed..

 

[Yellow Fang]

I liked the chap on Channel 4 news whose work was a set of light bulbs that switched themselves on and off every thirty seconds. The reserve price was fifty grand, which entitled you to a certificate to reproduce the art work at your own home (or private gallery I assume). When asked whether it was art, he said he didn't even know what art was, so he felt uncomfortable using the term.

 

[Archie_tect]

Now, that, on the other hand, took a little thought and a spark of 'something' I won't call genius, but something good.

A thought process that very few would have & quite literally leaves an impression.

Not elegant. or truthful, though is it?

 

[SteCenturion]

Not elegant. or truthful, though is it?

Elegant it is not, artisan not, truthful ?
I don't know, as I am unsure of your meaning, possibly could answer if you were to expand on the thought Archie.

 

[MontyVeda]

Not elegant. or truthful, though is it?

I'd call it elegant... and it's certainly a truthful representation of the inside space of a house. Each to their own i guess.

 

[SteCenturion]

I'd call it elegant... and it's certainly a truthful representation of the inside space of a house. Each to their own i guess.

Yes, I am swayed & was leaning towards truthful.

This is something, although not classically beautiful I could gorge upon for a time.

A work that I would normally hate to admit has any qualities, but has a something.

 

[slowmotion]

Tracey's bed is fun. I like it a lot but I wouldn't spend a penny of my hard-earned moolah on it. Piero's poo seems much better value for money.

http://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/artblog/2007/jun/12/****manzonisworkdoesntdow

Edit: Oh dear, that link doesn't seem to work. I'll try and find another.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artist's_Shit

 

[Archie_tect]

A truthful representation would not be solid, it would have light and depth and space... it's not truthful because it fills the voids with dull boring concrete yet it doesn't/ couldn't represent the actual filled voids because it wouldn't be supported because the floors, the internal walls and the ceilings would separate them, so it's a heavy, over-engineered monolith, devoid of life or feelings... you can't see any of the fittings cast in negative relief because they are simply buried in fluidly poured concrete... there's no depth or profile, unless that was a social comment about the society the house represents.

...you can glean from this that I don't like solidity, I like light and space, and artworks you can get into.... ie you can climb into a picture or a space and imagine...

 

[Fnaar]

Tracey's bed is fun. I like it a lot but I wouldn't spend a penny of my hard-earned moolah on it.

I wouldn't spend my wad on Tracey's bed, either.

 

[Mad Doug Biker]

I did not say all art is rubbish, read my other posts above.

Given your reaction, you might as well have though.

But I also do not think that art is a language.

That's where I fundamentally disagree - To do these things properly, you really need to know what you are doing, and for the observer to understand it properly, it helps if they actually know what they are looking at and so on.

Most never find out either, and what's more, most people learn how to read and write, but when it comes to art, its just left as this mysterious maelstrom which is viewed as being nothing but pretentious rubbish, so people never learn how to 'read' artwork properly.

I thought CoG, Sweet Pea and User482's posts below summed it up nicely:

[QUOTE 3160918, member: 1314"]I’ve been thinking about this in the context of the written word. Why don’t peeps who have such a dislike for ‘modern’ art not have the same reaction to ‘modern’ literature? I think it’s to do with accessibility. Let’s take, for example, a piece of writing such as James Joyce’s Ulysses. The edited inaccessible version. Not many people without a strong interest in ‘high’ literature will have a strong view about it, as they will not have encountered its contents. Tracy Emin’s Bed, on the other hand, is easily accessed, seen, and a gut judgement made. And because the negative judger has not engaged with the thinking behind it, it’s dismissed as ‘cack’. I wonder what Emin’s visceral detractors would make of Ulysses.

FWIW I think Ulysses a self-obsessed exclusive bore, and Emin superficial but funny and carnally attractive, but then I’m more of a folksy anyway. I’d rather Bukowski then Joyce; and Mexican Funeral masques than Emin. However a lot of peeps who dislike Joyce/Emin are those grown-ups who read Harry Potter or 50 Shades of Gray on the tube, and have prints of Dorset Sunsets by a local amateur watercolourist who learnt to paint in retirement at evening class.

Art at its best – no matter what medium – should be unsettling, subversive and thoughtful. At a very basic level I can give the example of my then 4 year old when given a paper bag by the Tate Modern as part of their kids’ activities. It had ‘This is not a paper bag’ written on it, which he found hilarious.[/QUOTE]

I think it's also to do with the apparent easiness of much conceptual art. Even people who think they can write reasonably well know they could never write a book, but arranging 124 bricks into a rectangle, or painting an entire canvas purple? "Our Ron could do that, and he's 7!" Also, Brits have always hated clever dicks, and 'pretentious' clever dicks, well...you just want to poke 'em in the eye, don't you?

People were saying the same thing about impressionism. All those thick brush strokes - a child could do that.

I do agree that people liking art depends on how it is perceived

Yes, which brings up the age old question of 'What is art?'

but when something is worth an extortionate amount of money just because the artist is known and the Tate decide to exhibit it, it gets my goat.

Yep, got me there, but then again, you only have took at a lot of 'luxury' items out there to see the same thing, designer labels for example, the cyclist who buys a Rapha jacket, even someone paying more for a brand name product in a supermarket as a pose to the store's own version..... We are all affected by it to some extent.

At the end of the day, who cares? Where, in the great scheme of things does it really matter, even the big corporate buyers who are buying for profit? Where does that affect the average person on the street?

I find many things can be art, normally functional things.

A beautiful guitar I can see, smell, play & hear for example.

A beautiful car or motorcycle I could drive or at least see driven & smell the fumes of it's petroleum burning.

Any grand, artisan built building in Manchester or any other City.

These are just a tiny proportion of what I consider art & to top it off they are all available to view in 3D.

Yes, I love a great painting or photograph & sculptures,the design of oppulent gardens (even though I am not the flowery horticultural type).

A pile of bricks though is a pile of bricks, a $#1THEAP bed is just that & no amount of flannel from some hooray Henry will ever convince me otherwise.

Yet again, what is art?

I liked the chap on Channel 4 news whose work was a set of light bulbs that switched themselves on and off every thirty seconds. The reserve price was fifty grand, which entitled you to a certificate to reproduce the art work at your own home (or private gallery I assume). When asked whether it was art, he said he didn't even know what art was, so he felt uncomfortable using the term.

And again, where exactly do you draw the line? What IS art??

 

[DooDah]

Artist creates something. Person wants to pay large sum to buy the creation.

Art is often a good investment, I bet whoever bought it will love having it, get great pleasure from it and potentially sell it for a tidy profit down the line.

Why on earth is that the business of anyone else let alone getting annoyed by it? Or are people not allowed to buy what they want for what they want any more?

It is surely the business of everyone when it is in the public domain, if people want to like it or get annoyed by it then it is up to them. You may argue that it is due to the media that it is in the public domain, but without the media most art would be seen by few and therefore not worth a substantial amount of money, IMO. In my opinion, the unmade bed ridiculous beyond belief, but others opinions may differ. I am not against modern art, but some of it is utter rubbish IMO. Are you seeing the theme here???? IMO.

Everyone is entitled to buy what they want, but if it is in the public domain then of course people are going to comment or have opinions.

FWIW, my mother does some amazing sculptures in bronze (IMO), that if marketed or exhibited in large galleries, could sell for a lot of money. However, she does it out of enjoyment and nothing more.

 

[srw]

Makes me think of Rothko's Rust and Blue (No 61)...

Load of pretentious bollocks.

 

[srw]

As far as I'm aware... 'art' has no function, no purpose other than to be observed and possibly discussed, whilst 'design' has a function, be it a building, LP cover, kitchen utensil or chair. One may reserve the right to call something whatever they like, but that doesn't mean they're right.

Certainly until the 16th century or so at least many people would have disagreed with you. Most Western art - or what now call art - was produced with a definite function, to provide a focus for Christian worship.