Confrontation with a motorist: I did nothing wrong this time

[dawesome]

We must never comment on poor driving, we must cower and shrink and defer at all times. If someone takes a stupid risk that puts people in danger NEVER do anything and if that driver goes on to kill someone your conscience will be unblemished.

 

[Boris Bajic]

I cannot beleive people are agreeing with the drivers actions. Yes cutting the corner is minor and a non-incident, but I only passed comment. It was up to the driver to infuriate things. I wasnt expecting or anticipating anything less than the car just driving away.
The reason I passed comment was that the corner cut was very large and someone could have been coming from the other direction.

Matthew, I haven't re-read the whole thread, but I don't think I've seen a post agreeing with the driver's actions.

Very many of the responses are helpful, constructive and positive, which is a rarity on an Internet forum.

In earlier threads quite a few people advised you that it was only a matter of time before your reaction to poor driving provoked a physical response. The incident on this thread almost got you one.

Most of the posters on this thread are firmly on your side. Many are also very concerned that you will end up getting hurt.

Many of the responses advising caution are from people like me, people in their 40s or 50s who've spent many decades driving and cycling with nary a harsh word spoken or heard.

In my sleepy market town I see scores of cars cutting corners every week. Where no other road users are endangered, it elicits no response from the police. Once the driver in your clip had (aggressively) asked what you said, it was like the mood in a boxing ring just before the bell for Round One. There were several opportunities to remove yourself from the situation, but every swing of your spade dug the hole a little deeper. Do please review the tape, maybe with someone else pointing out places where silence might have served you better.

On a not-entirely-unconnected note, I believe there may be some truth in the notion that your aggressor, now enraged, is not going to be driving very considerately immediately after that little spat and may feel slightly negative around bicycles for the foreseeable future. All actions have consequences. Even if you are quite happy to elicit the sort of response you witnessed, the next person this driver meets may not be.

I really would counsel you to think very hard before passing comment on the actions or behaviour of another road user. The best option would be to think long and hard until they are out of sight and out of earshot.

I and many others on this forum wish you well, but we also fear that you will continue unwittingly to provoke this sort of reaction until you receive a bash on the nose or worse.

I hope this post doesn't offend.

 

[Matthew_T]

I only expect to be met with physical agression when I give verbal agression. At no point in this situation did I swear, gode, or start a physical confrontation. It was up to him to follow me. I felt that the incident should have stopped when I first made comment but from that point on it was all the drivers fault.

Why should I feel scared of the consequences of just commenting on the driving of others? People nowadays are let off with practically murder because people dont stand up for what they think is right. I had every right to pass comment as it may have affected me. I am not going to get a slattering from some people on here about me keeping my mouth shut, why should I? I have nothing to hide and can stand my ground when I want to. I am tired of being bullied into doing this and that. If I feel the need to comment, then I will. It is only up to me to comment.
This driver is not going to look at cyclists any differently as a result of this incident. I could have been standing as the exact point and commented, then what would have happened? Probably the same.

 

[Matthew_T]

There are people on here whom give reasonable and adult replies but there are quite a few who thing bullying is the way forward and in that case are no better than the driver in the incident here.

 

[Andrew_P]

The question is why did you feel the need to comment, also he seems to have outstanding hearing!!

Was going to give a long lecture and a few of my own versions but really lets face it Matthew needs to grow up, allow a bit of time for his voice to mature and put on about 2 stone if he is going to keep on winding up random motons more importantly he needs a good angry face. Maybe Ian and Fossy can post thiers up :-)

 

[Boris Bajic]

I only expect to be met with physical agression when I give verbal agression. At no point in this situation did I swear, gode, or start a physical confrontation[/B]. It was up to him to follow me. I felt that the incident should have stopped when I first made comment but from that point on it was all the drivers fault.

Why should I feel scared of the consequences of just commenting on the driving of others? People nowadays are let off with practically murder because people dont stand up for what they think is right. I had every right to pass comment as it may have affected me. I am not going to get a slattering from some people on here about me keeping my mouth shut, why should I? I have nothing to hide and can stand my ground when I want to. I am tired of being bullied into doing this and that. If I feel the need to comment, then I will. It is only up to me to comment.
This driver is not going to look at cyclists any differently as a result of this incident. I could have been standing as the exact point and commented, then what would have happened? Probably the same.

Matt,

1. If you only expect physical aggression when you offer verbal aggression, you have a few surprises coming your way in life. Humankind has distilled unprovoked violence to an art form. It is as well to know this and be prepared for it.

2. The driver was in the wrong and his actions later in the footage were inexcusable and moronic. Nonetheless, many dispassionate viewers would argue that he was goaded when he first stopped his car. You may think otherwise. Some people who post on this forum may think otherwise. Many will have seen your "See Ya" and your reading of his plate as a form of goading. He certainly seemed to.

The actions of the driver were disgraceful, but many viewers of your tape might harbour the tiny suspicion that there was a hint of goading from you. The great majority of contributors to this forum do not want to see you coming to any harm.

 

[Panter]

I bet angry man isn't normally that angry and Matthew just happen to wind him up with his comments

.

I obviously don't know the man but I disagree. Had it been me in the car, I may have felt a little affronted by the comments of a young cyclist but certainly wouldn't have pursued him.
To false him to a stop and then threaten to "knock him out" are not the actions of a person in sound enough state of mind to be driving.

Personally, had I been in Mathews situation, I may have shook my head at the cutting of the junction, but wouldn't have commented. I just see too much of it and it's not a big deal in my opinion, just lazy.
Had it been me though I doubt the driver would've reacted the same way, I'm a long, long way from an 8 Stone 18 Year old.

Hopefully you'll get a result Matthew, although IMO you did escalate it, you may well have saved someone else from serious harm. Lord knows how he's have reacted had he cut someone up and got shouted at.

I think you need to chill out a little bit more. Sadly driving standards today are absolute crap, and sometimes you have to just let people get on with it provided no-one is endangered, obviously.
It's not right, but you shouldn't be endangering yourself for the cause.

 

[Linford]

This guy did not get things wrong, he made things wrong. I didnt antagonise him (the "see ya" comment may have been uncalled for) and I didnt raise my voice like I used to in the past. I thought that I handled the situation well and didnt cause a confrontation. It was the drivers choice to stop and cause a situation when I simply passed comment, which wasnt even directed at him, it was at his standard of driving.

If this country is going to persist that people can operate a vehicle which can kill hundreds of lives out of a few driving lessons and a document which says that you are 'Safe to drive' then why can I not pass comment on the poor driving standards of some? I had every right to be displeased with the driving.

What if I had been moving from the left of the junction to the right to turn right? He would have gone straight into the side of me and knocked me off. I could go around all day saying if this, and if that but what if next time this and other motorists arent as lucky as to have noone turning right?

He reacted badly, but you deliberately wound him up. The confrontation was instigated and perpetuated by your actions. He was wrongto cut the corner, but he didn't risk anyones life or even inconvenience anyone. Crossing a broken line in the road is not a criminal offence.

You may not be so lucky next time, but hey, we were all young, cocky and blase about the consequences of our actions at one stage. Wear a gumshield next time

 

[Andrew_P]

Luckily someone like him rarely takes it further, he was getting his rocks off on bullying a young person, 100% sure he wouldn't have done it if the rider was mature and looked like he might be able to handle himself.

 

[Jimmy Doug]

There are people on here whom give reasonable and adult replies but there are quite a few who thing bullying is the way forward and in that case are no better than the driver in the incident here.

Who is bullying you Mathew? The only bully I can see is the one who chased you in his car and threatened to ram your bike up your nose. Every single person who's written on this thread has your best interests at heart. We don't want to see you hurt, that's all - irrespective of the position that we take (for or against your comments). Personally, I think you should learn to keep your comments to yourself - but that's not bullying. The vast majority of people here hold the same opinion as me, and they're not bullies either. Listen to the advice you're getting from these very experienced cyclists and you may avoid a very nasty incident in the future.

 

[snapper_37]

I use this junction every day and 9/10, someone cuts the corner and I don't blink an eye - luckily I turn left. Even google maps managed to catch someone.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Wolverhampton WV4 6EH&hl=en&ll=52.574634,-2.114042&spn=0.000822,0.002401&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=6.491479,19.665527&oq=wv4 6eh&hnear=Wolverhampton WV4 6EH, United Kingdom&t=m&z=19&layer=c&cbll=52.574816,-2.113995&panoid=Tvmoz7-2MtSi6UCbPowDDQ&cbp=12,13.17,,0,0

Last night though, WVM cut it that much he came a little too close for comfort, I couldn't help but loudly mutter 'farkwit'. Since he was on the phone, there was no chance of him hearing me and so he just carried on his merry little way without a care that one day a cyclist might be turning right.

In Matt_T's case, yes the driving was crap, yes the driver was a bully and waaaayyy over the top with the reaction. However, as others have said, it is best to keep your gob shut, especially (and this is my opinion of the vid) as you didn't seem to be in any danger.

 

[dodgy]

We must never comment on poor driving, we must cower and shrink and defer at all times. If someone takes a stupid risk that puts people in danger NEVER do anything and if that driver goes on to kill someone your conscience will be unblemished.

All well and good, but I understand Matthew is almost a child, certainly a child's build. Leave the challenging to adults who at least can defend themselves and have a lifetime of experience and social skills to draw on.

 

[gambatte]

I was over in North Wales a couple of weeks ago, you notice a few things about the language.
ambulance =ambiwlans
Taxi = Tacsi
Burger = byrger
When I saw the vid, my first thoughts were "OMFG - they don't all talk Welsh all the time"
or was that actually Welsh and should be reported : "I'll ram that byke up your fwcking noes"

 

[stowie]

The advice to Matthew on considering just how nutty some people in cars are out there is probably justified. I don't admonish drivers unless they are in the process of putting my life in danger. I do report those really antisocial ones that I catch on camera to roadsafe though. This driver seems a bit deranged to pick up on a comment made in passing and then chase down MattT to offer up physical violence. Some issues going on here methinks...

On a related note I wonder why drivers do this. There are loons on cycles as well. I knew of one guy who rode a cycle to facilitate his drug dealing and kept at least a hammer on his person "for protection". He was absolutely someone I wouldn't want to confront over something like this.

 

[Boris Bajic]

We must never comment on poor driving, we must cower and shrink and defer at all times. If someone takes a stupid risk that puts people in danger NEVER do anything and if that driver goes on to kill someone your conscience will be unblemished.

I'm not sure anyone is suggesting we go this far in non-intervention.

It may be a case of picking one's battles and assessing what the benefit (and the cost) of getting involved might be.

There may also be a case for making a judgement about whether it is worth rebuking a driver for a low-speed piece of urban corner-cutting where no other road user was at risk and no-one was harmed.

The great majority of road users are skilled, courteous and attentive. I find that non-driving cyclists (or those who are inexperienced drivers) can sometimes be less tolerant of other road users than those who drive regularly.

There's a lot to be said for just rubbing along with other people and enjoying the ride or drive.