Couple of Brompton clones on Ebay (being sold as Bromptons)

[CycleCat]

It’s genuine!

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What happened:
We looked into your report and didn’t find the listing to be in violation of our policy. This determination was made by a customer service agent.

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Your reference ID:
2-109296572731

Here are the listings you reported that are included in this decision:
Item: 920004626020 Brompton Folding Bike


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I received the same reply despite listing numerous differences between these and genuine Bromptons.

 

[CycleCat]

Even with the list of differences I spotted, I can't believe I completely missed this non-Brompton fold!
The handlebars are in the middle of the fold 🤓

 

[Gunk]

Even with the list of differences I spotted, I can't believe I completely missed this non-Brompton fold!
The handlebars are in the middle of the fold 🤓

View attachment 823778

The front wheel is just facing the wrong way

 

[Fastpedaller]

Did hear some time back that the reason Brommies are brazed is because they use different grades of CroMo for different parts of the frame. This meant only brazing could be used, and not TIG.
Now, I don't claim to be a metallurgist, merely a hobbyist welder, but find this reason for brazing to be somewhat flimsy.
I suspect the CroMo for Brommies to be of consistent grade throughout the frame, and could be TIG'ed just as effectively, in terms of strength of welds and the required skillset needed.
To me, the only advantage of brazing is cosmetic - they do look nice under a clearcoat, and really pop.
I genuinely would like to know of any other reason to braze, rather than TIG, for this application

PS - just thought of a reason - to differentiate the real ones from the clones

I agree that doesn't look like a genuine Brompton - the derailleur is one give-away.
As regards the welding being 'as strong as brazing' - this isn't a 'given' and the processes and results are different. Welding uses a higher temperature than brazing and melts the parent metal. Brazing could maybe be described as 'gluing the parts together at a molecular level'. Because welding melts the metal, there is a large difference in temperature between the welded metal and the non-welded metal at the edge of the weldpool - this is the place where a crack is most likely to occur. In days of old a welder using gas could heat the surrounding metal to cherry red after welding to mitigate the chance of future problems.
Testing of both products (as far as accelerated-use testing is able ) could give an idea of failure modes to compare.
I can give an example of brazing vs welding...... I have a kit car with cycle wings; After a few months' use, the bolt-on wing stays supplied by the manufacturer broke just above where the solid end was welded to the tube, at the edge of the weld. I replicated the wing stays using mild steel tube brazed to solid ends - after 30 + years they are still intact, despite tens of thousands miles and vibrations.

 

[Drago]

Imdeed, its not an automatic given, but unless the brazing has an excessive fillet - and thus unnecessary extra weight - like for like TIG welding is typically a third to half as strong afijn as a brazed join.

Theres actually nothing wrong with brazing, but it brings extra weight and is relatively labour intensive for no gain.