CS7 Blue cycle route London - The Police are watching you

[CopperBrompton]

True as far as it goes, but it is illegal for cyclists to filter into the ASL (i.e. passing traffic) by any means other than the feeder lane on the left.

You're mistaken: read the Highway Code rule again.

All traffic must stop at the second stop line. Only motorised traffic must stop at the first one.

 

[benb]

That sounds crazy! I use a couple of ASLs where there is no filter lane but when there is a lot of traffic I just filter to the front and wait in the ASL. It just doesn't make sense to me. If there was no ASL then I could still filter all the way to the front so what difference does it make to go into the ASL from say the middle of two lands of traffic facing the same direction?

You're right, it is mental.

Can you show me where this information comes from?

I'll try and dig out where I read it, can't remember right now.

You're mistaken: read the Highway Code rule again.

All traffic must stop at the second stop line. Only motorised traffic must stop at the first one.

AFAIK, that only applies where you're approaching an ASL with a red signal and there is no traffic in front of you. If you have to filter, then you MUST use the filter lane on the left to enter the ASL. If there is no filter lane then you cannot enter the ASL.

I'll try and find the actual source for what I think I know!!

 

[crumpetman]

Found this on http://bicycle-train...ne_for_cyclists

Entrance by Bikes into the Cycle Reservoir
This may sound strange, but in the main bikes are governed by the same rules as cars when it comes to cycle reservoirs. Cyclists can only technically enter the reservoir if there is a feeder bike lane, with a dotted line, which filters into the reservoir. If there isn't a feeder lane, and just a solid stop line that the cars are stopped at, as a cyclist you are supposed to stop there to.

Of course, common sense dictates that this is a frankly ridiculous situation, as it negates any purpose assigned to the advanced stop line and cycle reservoir. General usage, and logic, therefore means that it's unlikely anyone will ever be fined or given a talking to for riding into a cycle reservoir without a feeder lane.

 

[CopperBrompton]

AFAIK, that only applies where you're approaching an ASL with a red signal and there is no traffic in front of you. If you have to filter, then you MUST use the filter lane on the left to enter the ASL.

There is no such concept in law as 'filtering', it is simply 'overtaking'.

Technically, cyclists break many of the Highway Code rules on overtaking when they filter (you can argue, for example, that filtering up to a traffic light is overtaking close to a junction), but there is nothing in law or the HC that specifies how cyclists are to enter an ASL box.

 

[BentMikey]

AFAIK, that only applies where you're approaching an ASL with a red signal and there is no traffic in front of you. If you have to filter, then you MUST use the filter lane on the left to enter the ASL. If there is no filter lane then you cannot enter the ASL.

I'll try and find the actual source for what I think I know!!

Benb is right, roughly. Sometimes it pays not to be so self-assured but wrong.

 

[CopperBrompton]

Found this on http://bicycle-train...ne_for_cyclists

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Which is the common myth I refer to. In law, the first stop line does not exist for cyclists. It exists only for motorised traffic.

 

[benb]

http://www.cityoflondon.police.uk/CityPolice/Advice/TrafficTravel/ontheroad.htm#stoplines

Cyclists are required to enter this Advanced Stop Box area by the prescribed cycle lane

In other words, if the light is red, and either there is no filter lane, or that lane is blocked, you are committing an offence if you cross the first stop line. You'll notice that where there is a filter lane the first stop line doesn't go all the way to the left, so by using the lane you don't actually cross the first stop line.

 

[crumpetman]

Which is the common myth I refer to. In law, the first stop line does not exist for cyclists. It exists only for motorised traffic.

Yep, I can't find anything else to say that cyclists cannot enter the ASL without using a feeder lane. On my route I do not usually make use of the feeder lane anyway as it is not particularly safe.

 

[hackbike 666]

So why do you run red lights? All it saves you is a fraction of 1 minute. If you're in such a tearing hurry to get to your destination, perhaps you should either leave earlier or re-evaluate your time-management priorities?

I'm with some of the others on this thread: you've only yourself to blame, plus you're causing other cyclists to bear the brunt of aggression from those motorists too shortsighted to see that all cyclists aren't the same.

That's the problem...you jump a red and cause an accident then it's your fault and should get the book thrown at you.....I doubt in todays blameless society that the RLJer would admit being at fault (or take any blame) as they are almost as stupid as mobile phone wielding motorists.

At least some of the RLJing I have seen has been mind boggingly stupid...and why? To save a few seconds....Now what does that remind me of?

Yes of course,the motorist doing the close overtake to race up to the next set of lights....Reminds me I have some vids to check over.

 

[crumpetman]

http://www.cityoflon...d.htm#stoplines



In other words, if the light is red, and either there is no filter lane, or that lane is blocked, you are committing an offence if you cross the first stop line. You'll notice that where there is a filter lane the first stop line doesn't go all the way to the left, so by using the lane you don't actually cross the first stop line.

That's not what is says though. The text on that site is clearly aimed at motorists, not cyclists. It does not state what a cyclist can or should do presented with an ASL with no feeder lane.

 

[benb]

Which is the common myth I refer to. In law, the first stop line does not exist for cyclists. It exists only for motorised traffic.

I think you're wrong. I can't find the specific legislation though.

 

[400bhp]

http://www.cityoflon...d.htm#stoplines



In other words, if the light is red, and either there is no filter lane, or that lane is blocked, you are committing an offence if you cross the first stop line. You'll notice that where there is a filter lane the first stop line doesn't go all the way to the left, so by using the lane you don't actually cross the first stop line.

I believe they hav e made this up. There doesn't appear to be any reference to this in the legislation.

 

[benb]

http://www.opsi.gov....20023113.htm#43

<a name="43">Where the road marking shown in diagram 1001.2 has been placed in conjunction with light signals, "stop line" in relation to those light signals means -

• (a) the first stop line, in the case of a vehicle (other than a pedal cycle proceeding in the cycle lane) which has not proceeded beyond that line; or
  
  (b ) the second stop line, in the case of a vehicle which has proceeded beyond the first stop line or of a pedal cycle proceeding in the cycle lane.

So, the stop line is defined as the first stop line for all vehicles, or the second stop line for bicycles proceeding in the cycle lane. So if there is no cycle lane, or if you are not in the cycle lane for any reason, the first stop line is the stop line.

 

[Origamist]

ASL enforcement and access to the reservoir is confusing. The HC is pretty clear on the subject (different lines for different classes of vehicles). However, there is not a specific ASL encroachment offence, it comes under the general offence of contravening an automatic traffic signal.

In London, there has been an ongoing debate about cyclists entering the ASL reservoir if they do not use a filter lane or “gate” (a stubbie cycle lane), or what to do if neither is present.

This Bill clarifies/muddies the water further in London: London Local Authorities and Transport for London (No. 2) Bill

Clause 28 deals with two general issues relating to advanced stopping areas for cyclists.

The first is that technically it is an offence for a cyclist to enter the stopping area if there

is no cycle lane marked on the highway that feeds into the stopping area. The clause

would have the effect of clarifying that where there is an advanced stopping area but

no feeder lane, then no offence is committed by cyclists who enter the stopping area at

a red light signal.



The second issue dealt with by Clause 28 is related. It provides that in cases where there

is a feeder lane, a cyclist would not commit an offence if he had to enter the stopping

area by crossing the first stop line, if the feeder lane is obstructed.

http://www.publicati...2_11_07/017.pdf

 

[crumpetman]

Ok, so we are back to it being a technicality and not something that you would get pulled over/fined for. IT IS ridiculous though. I still cannot believe it is the case, there must be some legislation that is not so vague, something that specifically mentions bicycles and ASLs with no feeder lane.