Cycle paths adjacent to main roads

[ebikeerwidnes]

The idea fo Give Way signs before the cycle path - rather than the normal after it

are fine

but as said before - the problem is getting driver to respect it

 

[mjr]

It's in Cyclecraft.

John Franklin apparently can't ride properly on cycleways. His advice in Cyclecraft will get you a load of abuse on busy cycleways in Cambridge or London. Ignore that chapter of his book. It's only advice, not rules.

 

[HLaB]

Whenever I point out the amount of energy wasted by stopping at every side road I'm told that cycle paths can be laid out to give cyclists priority, but if you want to stay out of a wheelchair, the issue isn't about giving the priority to cyclists, it's about having motorists who'll respect it.

That is definitely a problem some places design continuous footways (or Copenhagen Crossings) properly to influence the driver to stop in the right place, it does help that Europe has better legal protection for cyclists, but this Blog has a lot of good info.
https://robertweetman.wordpress.com/2018/11/13/design-details-1/

 

[HLaB]

Avenues - Glasgow City Council https://share.google/bsK6pi4bwNEyn7ayu

OT was the street in the cover page the one Van der Pol descended a little too fast in the world champs and had that heart in the mouth moment as he turned right?

 

[Bristolian]

The idea fo Give Way signs before the cycle path - rather than the normal after it

are fine

but as said before - the problem is getting driver to respect it

The problem is getting drivers to see, read and understand the signs.

The number and concentration of road signs that highways authorities appear to be believe are needed for every potential hazard has resulted in information overload so drivers stop looking at them. Instead they rely on memory of the road layout rather than creating active driving plans based on what they can see and what they might reasonably expect to happen.

 

[HLaB]

The problem is getting drivers to see, read and understand the signs.

The number and concentration of road signs that highways authorities appear to be believe are needed for every potential hazard has resulted in information overload so drivers stop looking at them. Instead they rely on memory of the road layout rather than creating active driving plans based on what they can see and what they might reasonably expect to happen.

Sign clutter is thankfully starting to get recognised and IMHO you are better to design a layout that naturally enforces behaviour change rather than relying on a sign that can be missed or ignored. Lack of signage also can create a degree of uncertainous when backed up with the correct layout which forces folk to pause.

 

[andrew_s]

In Gloucestershire they've been building a new cycle route that's meant to end up going Bishop's Cleeve - Cheltenham - Gloucester - Stroud.
https://www.gloucestershire.gov.uk/major-projects-list/gloucestershire-cycle-spine/

It's been slow going, but the Gloucester to Cheltenham stretch that is completed is actually pretty good, and even most regular cyclists use it in preference to the road.
They've even taken away significant car space, with the remaining one lane each way being fairly narrow, and with a 30 limit the whole way (used to be 50 away from housing). In the screenclip below, the green of the cycle track more or less indicates the width that the cars have lost.
StreetView isn't up to date, but this is an example, showing proper cycle priority at a side road.

https://maps.app.goo.gl/RBt14A9cmVbti4KL8

They are currently working on Cheltenham to Bishop's Cleeve, which is sorely needed from a cycling point of view. There's the one direct A road via Racecourse roundabout, and it's both narrow and fast, and the two alternatives (B4632 to Prestbury and Hyde Lane to Swindon Village) are both significantly further and not all that much better to ride on at busy times.

Gloucester to Stroud is being still planned, but the indications are that it will largely follow a current cycling route.

 

[blackrat]

I am quite sure that when I travel through an urban environment I am going to look at the road and if I feel it is adequate for me to make my way through it, I am going for it, regardless of cycleways, cycle signage and paths- shared or otherwise. I cannot imagine I would be alone.
The more we are seen cycling on the road the more we will be accepted.

 

[Dadam]

Give way lines aren't the solution

How about this one. Sight lines are fine and it should be pretty damn obvious from the lines where a car emerging from the side road should be stopping to give way. But no, the number of cars that pull up to the double yellow to wait for a gap in the cars. Sometimes they'll bully their way between pedestrians to sit right across blocking the cycle lane. 🤦‍♂️

 

[Bristolian]

In Gloucestershire they've been building a new cycle route that's meant to end up going Bishop's Cleeve - Cheltenham - Gloucester - Stroud.
https://www.gloucestershire.gov.uk/major-projects-list/gloucestershire-cycle-spine/

It's been slow going, but the Gloucester to Cheltenham stretch that is completed is actually pretty good, and even most regular cyclists use it in preference to the road.
They've even taken away significant car space, with the remaining one lane each way being fairly narrow, and with a 30 limit the whole way (used to be 50 away from housing). In the screenclip below, the green of the cycle track more or less indicates the width that the cars have lost.
StreetView isn't up to date, but this is an example, showing proper cycle priority at a side road.
View attachment 803074
https://maps.app.goo.gl/RBt14A9cmVbti4KL8

They are currently working on Cheltenham to Bishop's Cleeve, which is sorely needed from a cycling point of view. There's the one direct A road via Racecourse roundabout, and it's both narrow and fast, and the two alternatives (B4632 to Prestbury and Hyde Lane to Swindon Village) are both significantly further and not all that much better to ride on at busy times.

Gloucester to Stroud is being still planned, but the indications are that it will largely follow a current cycling route (Sharpness canal towpath, cross the A38 at Whitminster, and into Stroud on the Ebley bypass cycle track (off highway).

Yes, I have ridden the Gloucester to Cheltenham bit and it is really very good

Bristol City and South Gloucestershire councils are in the midst of creating a segregated cycle/walk way from Bristol city centre all the way to Thornbury. Those parts that have been completed are a huge improvement on that never existed before and I'm looking forward to the stretch up to Thornbury being completed as that will mean I won't have to ride on the A38 anymore. Scary stuff at times

 

[mjr]

The more we are seen cycling on the road the more we will be accepted.

That hasn't worked for the last hundred years. The definition of madness is to keep repeating the same action and expect different results.

 

[Mike_P]

That hasn't worked for the last hundred years. The definition of madness is to keep repeating the same action and expect different results.

Maybe something on the lines of vusually raided markings would work better
https://www.bbc.co.uk/bbcthree/article/3e316454-02b6-4b1a-8369-da71a2377f25
Snag being how effective after a number of years given the lack of maintenance.

 

[blackrat]

That hasn't worked for the last hundred years. The definition of madness is to keep repeating the same action and expect different results.

Really I don't where you have been but a hundred years ago there were cyclists all over the place and what cars there were then gave way to them. The same continued well into the 1980's. These days all is intended not to impede motorists, and giving them the excuse for their boorish behaviour but placing cycle lanes and the like alongside roads is tantamount to agreeing cyclists are a nuisance and should be told in no uncertain terms: "Get of the road and onto the on the cycle path". Take the lane, we have a right to be there.

 

[Dogtrousers]

there were cyclists all over the place and what cars there were then gave way to them. The same continued well into the 1980's.

My memory of cycling in London 1980 onwards was that it was like the wild west. Fewer cyclists than now and no one giving you an inch of space. Fortunately I had the youthful sense of invincibility and the ability to bounce, something that I had to do several times.

There was one nod towards cycling - they allowed cyclists into bus lanes. Not that everyone agreed with this decision. I remember tailgating a bus at Camberwell Green and the conductor was absolutely incandescent with rage, hanging off the back and shouting abuse at me for being in the bus lane.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Really I don't where you have been but a hundred years ago there were cyclists all over the place and what cars there were then gave way to them. The same continued well into the 1980's. These days all is intended not to impede motorists, and giving them the excuse for their boorish behaviour but placing cycle lanes and the like alongside roads is tantamount to agreeing cyclists are a nuisance and should be told in no uncertain terms: "Get of the road and onto the on the cycle path". Take the lane, we have a right to be there.

I was riding all over when I lived in the 1970s and 1980s

and by then the concept of cars giving way to bikes was well gone

By Dad grew up in the 1930s and he rode his bike all over North Liverpool and he said that cars and buses were becoming more and more common and you had to watch out for them even then
Nowhere near as many as now - but cyclists were not just granted priority when