Discs, are they the DBs?

[MichaelW2]

My commuter bike has 26" rims and on my front wheel build I could chose the rim, so went with a disc-specific one with no braking surface. I think we will start to see more lightweight road rims with no braking surface, maybe carbon clinchers.
I'm not sure if disk brakes need thu-axles. Suspension forks benefit from them to add some rigidity to the structure, but non sus forks. Thru axles won't be popular with team pro mechanics and that will filter down to what us commuters have available.

 

[raleighnut]

My commuter bike has 26" rims and on my front wheel build I could chose the rim, so went with a disc-specific one with no braking surface. I think we will start to see more lightweight road rims with no braking surface, maybe carbon clinchers.
I'm not sure if disk brakes need thu-axles. Suspension forks benefit from them to add some rigidity to the structure, but non sus forks. Thru axles won't be popular with team pro mechanics and that will filter down to what us commuters have available.

Disc brakes can have a tendency to cause the axle to 'climb' out of the dropout on heavy braking, through axles avoid this without the need for 'Lawyers Lips' or some other form of retention device (a tab that sits in a hole) on the fork.

 

[Kajjal]

Please explain how you can stop (pull up?) much quicker in the dry with discs rather than other types? Tell us which brake works and does what at maximum deceleration.

Of course QRs work, but you'll see a trend towards through axle because of user stupidity issues. Already the ambulance chasers are lining up. This can be seen by component manufacturers offering TA hubs and some fork manufacturers only offering TA in disc type. It is a trend, that's all.

Please give us detail about that skidding front wheel.

Its simple the braking force at the wheel with discs is several times greater than rim brakes. Also unlike cables hydraulic fluid does not stretch or get snagged. This combination means you get more braking power for less effort, more consistent braking and better feel. Rim brakes have less braking power and as well as using cables are less consistent, with less feel.

Have you ever ridden a bike road or mountain with proper hydraulic disc brakes?

I have ridden road and mountain bikes with quality rim and disc brakes in the dry and wet.

 

[MichaelW2]

Disc brakes can have a tendency to cause the axle to 'climb' out of the dropout on heavy braking, through axles avoid this without the need for 'Lawyers Lips' or some other form of retention device (a tab that sits in a hole) on the fork.

Lawyer lips are compulsory. The pull out is worst with downward-facing dropout, if they open forward and down, at an angle, the potential danger is much less. Thru-axles solve the issue but mainly they are for rigidity with susforks. Have there been any actual cases of pull-out with disc brakes?

 

[Tim Hall]

Its simple the braking force at the wheel with discs is several times greater than rim brakes. Also unlike cables hydraulic fluid does not stretch or get snagged. This combination means you get more braking power for less effort, more consistent braking and better feel. Rim brakes have less braking power and as well as using cables are less consistent, with less feel.

Have you ever ridden a bike road or mountain with proper hydraulic disc brakes?

I have ridden road and mountain bikes with quality rim and disc brakes in the dry and wet.

When you rode a rim braked road bike, could you stand it on its nose by over enthusiastic braking? I can. Once you do that, however more powerful the brakes are, they aren't going to make you stop any quicker. Same thing goes for the rear wheel - once it starts to skid, it's not gripping the road, so more powerful brakes aren't going to slow you down any.

 

[Sketty]

Ah yes but they do help you 'slice' through the field, heh heh

 

[Kajjal]

When you rode a rim braked road bike, could you stand it on its nose by over enthusiastic braking? I can. Once you do that, however more powerful the brakes are, they aren't going to make you stop any quicker. Same thing goes for the rear wheel - once it starts to skid, it's not gripping the road, so more powerful brakes aren't going to slow you down any.

Yes i could but avoided doing it. The key with disc brakes is you brake harder but avoid skidding due to more power, consistency of braking and feel. Also if you do skid a wheel for example on a looser surface you very quickly get it back as you have more control over the braking. On rim brakes there is less control.

The once you skid argument suggests a lack of control over braking.

Have you tried decent hydraulic disk brakes ?

 

[lutonloony]

Is your budget flexible? This is a good price with 105 and discs if the right size. More CX than road but you could probably add thinner slicker tyres and it doesn't sound like you want to race

https://www.merlincycles.com/merlin-x20-105-ar-commuter-cx-bike-2016-86641.html

Evans have a disc road bike for £700 but Sora

I'd just go for rim brakes unless planning to ride in all weathers.

Thanks for headsup wrt merlin, would prob be a little too steep for budget, plus would want to see it in the flesh. Thinking rims and 105 , but will have a mosey at Evans

 

[Yellow Saddle]

Yes i could but avoided doing it. The key with disc brakes is you brake harder but avoid skidding due to more power, consistency of braking and feel. Also if you do skid a wheel for example on a looser surface you very quickly get it back as you have more control over the braking. On rim brakes there is less control.

The once you skid argument suggests a lack of control over braking.

Have you tried decent hydraulic disk brakes ?

You need to rethink your argument. If you avoid standing on the front wheel, you are not using maximum braking, no matter what type of brake is applied. Draw yourself a force diagram with a turning moment around the front wheel contact patch.

Highwheelers had very weak paddle or spoon brakes because any better brake would rapidly overturn the rider with serious consequences. Newer style bikes like the one you and I ride are called safety bikes for the very reason that they don't overturn as easily as a highwheeler, however they still overturn long before the front wheel skids.

Motorcyclists and Tim do stoppies precisely because they have all the traction in the world but not a low-enough centre of gravity to take advantage of it.

 

[stuartmac]

In August 2014 I was 2 metres off the back wheel of my mate rolling in to Taunton at about 20mph as some idiot coming the other way swerved to turn right, he hit the car square on and I missed it by a knats arse. He was lucky to get away with a free trip in an ambulance.

After that trip, I bought a Genesis Equilibrium Ltd Ed specifically because it had hybrid disc brakes (amongst other factors) maybe it's a confidence thing but I wouldn't be without them on the road. Once you get used to them they are better all rounders than rim brakes, less stress on your hands over repeated 100 mile days, better in the wet and they don't wear your wheels away (although they do require more manintenance)

If your a Sunday morning cyclist it won't matter as I agree, rim brakes in the dry, there isn't much in it but if your doing any distance or touring and exposed to different weather events I'd go with discs every time. As for the weight issue, cut out that second bacon roll, it'll compensate for the rotor weight.

I'll never go back (for a road bike)

S

 

[park1]

If you are commuting in all weathers with lots of stop start at traffic lights etc then you will wear through rims with calipers. Mine tend to last 18 to 24 months and my commute is only 20 mins each way. Whilst rims can be cheap, if you can't build a wheel yourself (which I can't) then labour to rebuild the wheel can be relatively high. I'm not sure if discs last longer but they are cheaper and easier to replace for the home mechanic.
I do notice braking is poorer in the wet on my rim brakes, by which I mean to achieve the same braking distance I have haul on the brakes really hard. Braking in the wet will always be poorer regardless of whether you use discs or rims as the traction between the tyre and road is reduced.
I get the impression that when people say the braking on disc brakes is better, what they mean is it is more consistent and less force is needed to achieve the same result. Some feel this is a benefit, others are less bothered and sight increased weight, reduced aero performance and higher complexity as downsides.
I'm about to purchase a disc equipped bike for commuting so will be able to comment better soon :-D

 

[ianrauk]

I'm about to purchase a disc equipped bike for commuting

You won't regret your decision.

 

[T.M.H.N.E.T]

You won't regret your decision.

Nope

 

[park1]

After years on a single speed with 23mm rubber I'm really looking forward to plush 32mm rubber, gears and discs. Roll on summer and post work rides!

 

[Kajjal]

You need to rethink your argument. If you avoid standing on the front wheel, you are not using maximum braking, no matter what type of brake is applied. Draw yourself a force diagram with a turning moment around the front wheel contact patch.

Highwheelers had very weak paddle or spoon brakes because any better brake would rapidly overturn the rider with serious consequences. Newer style bikes like the one you and I ride are called safety bikes for the very reason that they don't overturn as easily as a highwheeler, however they still overturn long before the front wheel skids.

Motorcyclists and Tim do stoppies precisely because they have all the traction in the world but not a low-enough centre of gravity to take advantage of it.

Have you ridden a road bike or mountain bike with hydraulic disc brakes?

You keep avoiding the question so i am assuming not

I am comparing rim brakes to disc brakes on a bicycle and the difference in their ability to brake, you stated disc brakes are not better than rim brakes