Drivers that don't admit liability

[SportMonkey]

Insult rather than converse - I'm off to my cave, just outside Culcheth - I may well know the road you are on about

I'm quite happy to trade insults, but the passive-aggressive hypocrisy doesn't wash, if you give an insult, expect one back.

If you have a cave just outside Culcheth I wouldn't expect you to know the section of road, or traffic at the point of time I go through it. If you'd care to explain exactly where I went wrong with how the traffic flows there I'm all ears, or so to speak.

 

[bedrock]

I bought a £15 one from 7DayShop for this reason.

I'm interested. Do you have a link to the model you purchased? Is it waterproof?

 

[SportMonkey]

I'm interested. Do you have a link to the model you purchased? Is it waterproof?

Clicky it's yet to arrive, may be worth waiting until I've abused it a little.

 

[asterix]

Not trolling at all - as someone who has been on two wheels for 40+ years, I'm just getting a bit ticked of with the "it's all their fault" attitude - sometimes it is, sometimes it isn't; occasionally it's 50 / 50 or a simple judgemental error, which can of course have awful consequences, which is why I said we all have a part to play in anticipating what others may do.

If you want to argue, go down to a pub full of sixteen year-olds rather spit out childish comments from behind a keyboard.

There, you really should have taken my advice you know.

 

[blockend]

Wasn't there, didn't see it but personal experience suggests there's two kinds of reactions to these situations. If a car overtakes and slows down near a junction, the logical course is to cover the bike's brakes and be prepared to take evasive action.
Is it right that cars left hook? No. Does it happen? All the time. I've lost count of the times I've made involuntary left turns because the alternative is driving into the side or under the wheels of vehicle. It's not a case of lane positioning either, a car will cross from the outside lane if their motivation to turn is strong enough.

Some of it is poor spatial awareness, some of it is devilment (kids in hot hatches), some is don't GAF from commercial vehicles running against the clock. Whatever the cause, pressing on regardless is the worst possible course of action from the cyclists' point of view.

 

[SportMonkey]

Wasn't there, didn't see it but personal experience suggests there's two kinds of reactions to these situations. If a car overtakes and slows down near a junction, the logical course is to cover the bike's brakes and be prepared to take evasive action.
Is it right that cars left hook? No. Does it happen? All the time. I've lost count of the times I've made involuntary left turns because the alternative is driving into the side or under the wheels of vehicle. It's not a case of lane positioning either, a car will cross from the outside lane if their motivation to turn is strong enough.

Some of it is poor spatial awareness, some of it is devilment (kids in hot hatches), some is don't GAF from commercial vehicles running against the clock. Whatever the cause, pressing on regardless is the worst possible course of action from the cyclists' point of view.

You misred me, I didn't press on regardless from the point of the move, I had up to the point been cycling in normal traffic, I was pedalling full out when the driver was along side me, as soon as she turned I braked and turned with her, but alas, I had no chance.

 

[Chilternrides]

Wasn't there, didn't see it but personal experience suggests there's two kinds of reactions to these situations. If a car overtakes and slows down near a junction, the logical course is to cover the bike's brakes and be prepared to take evasive action.
Is it right that cars left hook? No. Does it happen? All the time. I've lost count of the times I've made involuntary left turns because the alternative is driving into the side or under the wheels of vehicle. It's not a case of lane positioning either, a car will cross from the outside lane if their motivation to turn is strong enough.

Some of it is poor spatial awareness, some of it is devilment (kids in hot hatches), some is don't GAF from commercial vehicles running against the clock. Whatever the cause, pressing on regardless is the worst possible course of action from the cyclists' point of view.

Blockend worded it far better than I did; therefore I left myself open to being accused of being a troll. Not my intentions at all - apologies SM.

 

[Angelfishsolo]

Your words for your earlier post - Mine is, they overtook me, didn't get past, and turned. I was still pedalling as I always do through that section of road. No mention of braking here.

You misred me, I didn't press on regardless from the point of the move, I had up to the point been cycling in normal traffic, I was pedalling full out when the driver was along side me, as soon as she turned I braked and turned with her, but alas, I had no chance.

 

[blockend]

It happens. My response is to not go full tilt in such situations unless I can avoid it because it triggers competitive instincts in idiot drivers. In fact behaving unpredictably is often your biggest safeguard, especially in high pressure roundabouts and crossroads. A driver will push things to the inch if they think they can get away with it and you finish up with stunt display team style misses.

Drift out, drift in, sprint and freewheel alternately, whatever it takes for the driver not to second guess your movements. Better a mouthful of abuse than a crunch.

 

[SportMonkey]

It happens. My response is to not go full tilt in such situations unless I can avoid it because it triggers competitive instincts in idiot drivers. In fact behaving unpredictably is often your biggest safeguard, especially in high pressure roundabouts and crossroads. A driver will push things to the inch if they think they can get away with it and you finish up with stunt display team style misses.

Drift out, drift in, sprint and freewheel alternately, whatever it takes for the driver not to second guess your movements. Better a mouthful of abuse than a crunch.

Incident here

I can see what you're saying, but I wasn't going full tilt in to the situation, I was pushing down and round my current route, the car passed after the merge and turned. It's a corner I'm careful on as it is due the the traffic exiting the junction (usually without looking) and the fact the junction feels more like a fork. My faulty assumption was that a car wouldn't turn when we were both travelling around 30mph with me along side it. I'm more careful now, but to avoid this I would have had to slow to a dead stop as soon as the car came along side me. The distances weren't all that good.

 

[blockend]

"I wasn't going full tilt in to the situation" and "were both travelling around 30mph with me along side it" don't tally. I'm not condoning the driver's actions but discretion is the better part of valour in these situations - expect stupidity and you'll rarely be disappointed.

 

[Angelfishsolo]

Amen

"I wasn't going full tilt in to the situation" and "were both travelling around 30mph with me along side it" don't tally. I'm not condoning the driver's actions but discretion is the better part of valour in these situations - expect stupidity and you'll rarely be disappointed.

 

[SportMonkey]

"I wasn't going full tilt in to the situation" and "were both travelling around 30mph with me along side it" don't tally. I'm not condoning the driver's actions but discretion is the better part of valour in these situations - expect stupidity and you'll rarely be disappointed.

I can see your point, it doesn't quite fit how I see things. In this situation I'd have had to stop pedalling and apply the brakes a lot earlier. I however can't argue with your logic for the majority of situations.

 

[Mad at urage]

"I wasn't going full tilt in to the situation" and "were both travelling around 30mph with me along side it" don't tally. I'm not condoning the driver's actions but discretion is the better part of valour in these situations - expect stupidity and you'll rarely be disappointed.

They tally quite well to me: Plenty of places on my commute where I can reach 30mph without going full tilt.

I'll have stopped pedaling in some of these - depends on the hill. On some hills I'll be pedaling enough to keep me in touch with the transmission, on others to keep up to the flow of the traffic. Stopping pedaling and starting to brake in the midst of heavy traffic can just as easily have an inattentive river into your back wheel, so the sensible response is not necessarily going to be braking whenever someone starts to overtake.

No-one who was not there knows what happened. Condemning SM for not having paid enough attention or avoided what may well have been an unavoidable collision is entirely misplaced. It is not always possible to out-brake a turning car, especially downhill.

 

[blockend]

It is not always possible to out-brake a turning car, especially downhill.

That simple truth informs my conduct around potentially turning cars.