Educate or prosecute?

What would you opt for?


  • Total voters
    81
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dellzeqq

pre-talced and mighty
Location
SW2
Can't teach an old dog new tricks.

Prosecute and take his licence away.
I'm not so sure he'd appreciate the 'old dog' but an inveterate speeder of my aquaintance has been reformed by his two day course. And when I say reformed, I mean given to lecturing anybody within range on the evils of speeding. Which, for a cyclist is not easy to take...

and I would imagine the costs to the justice system would be reduced. He paid for his course, which seems equitable enough
 

Bman

Guru
Location
Herts.
Yep. Prosecute. It's the only deterrant.

They have already had the education part. Its called a Driving Test.
 

downfader

extimus uero philosophus
Location
'ampsheeeer
I originally would have voted "educate" but from my experience and subsequent talk with people more in the know I think "prosecute" is perhaps the only real option. The educational course they sent my driver on was for speed awareness, nothing to do with caution around vulnerable road users and looking at junctions. On the plus side he had to fork out £164 iirc of his own money to go on it, and they had to stand up, address the room to say who they were and why they were there.
 

Crankarm

Guru
Location
Nr Cambridge
One other thing with points when the driver is not actually stopped at the time of any incident, is that other people may be willing to take them instead of the offender. I know of at least two people who got their mother to take speeding points for them. I doubt she would have attended an education course instead as she didn't drive at all despite holding a licence. And 12 points doesn't mean automatic disqualification either if mitigating circumstances can be argued.

Of course some people carry on without a licence and/or insurance. These people should be terminated prosecuted to the full extent of the law and ideally locked up for good spell and have any vehicles crushed and then have their testicles crushed with a big mallet (most are men i'm sure). You get the idea anyway. Some people just can't be educated or rehabilitated.
:evil:

I would guess a not so insignificant number of women drivers are also uninsured as well if we believe what we are told that around 2 million cars on UK roads are uninsured.
 
For me, I'd personally judge it on their attitude at the time of the RTC. If they were apologetic, concerned etc I might think about suggesting a course for them. If they were arrogant, unconcerned and trying to shift blame, I'd be more inclined to prosecute as I would doubt their ability to learn anything.
 
There is a school of thought that if what you have done to date is not working, you might do well to try something else.

Prosecution in the absence of education appears not to have had a massive effect over the past forty years.

There seems to be a groundswell of thinking among cyclists that motorists need educating on the matter of sharing the roads with other users.

It is commonly understood that some aspects of initial training (up to test standard) are not observed once the full licence is gained. I believe this holds true also for cyclists who drive. I know few drivers in their forties who still drive as they did to pass their test.

I think it might make one feel good to say "If they didn't learn the first time, why should we continue to educate?". It might feel good, but it might be flawed thinking.

Very often, ongoing training and education is the way to make sure that good practice is embedded. If the core group of students for 'ongoing or continuity training' are road users shown to have broken one or another part of the Road Traffic Act, is that not about as focussed as a training or education initiative can be?

I was banned while still too young to drive (a dreadful misunderstanding) and in my twenties I picked up endorsements (later points) like a dog collects fleas. It did not alter my driving. I could afford it and I continued to pay. Prosecution is fine, but without education it might just begin to lose its deterrent effect. It might not, of course.
 

gambatte

Middle of the pack...
Location
S Yorks
It is commonly understood that some aspects of initial training (up to test standard) are not observed once the full licence is gained. I believe this holds true also for cyclists who drive. I know few drivers in their forties who still drive as they did to pass their test.

I wonder how many times I heard the saying "First you learn to pass your test, then you learn to drive?"....:whistle:
 

sabian92

Über Member
Sorry, when it comes to re-testing its the sub 25 year olds who we should start with. Rather more over represented in the KSI statistics then their more mature peers. But then I'm not sure competence is the main issue. More attitude is the problem. Something harder to test for.


See, that annoys me because I'm 19, I passed at 17, and because of statistics i'm classed as a "dangerous" driver. I'm not but apparently "statistics don't lie"....

Some young people are bad drivers, some middle aged people are bad drivers and some old people are drivers. You can't box them all into their respective age groups as such and such because for 90% of people in that group, it isn't true.

I do think that older people are worst simply because their eyesight goes - it's a fact, not being being ageist.

Not all young people who drive are lager lout, Saxo driving chavs who have no care in the world about other road users.
 
OP
OP
middleagecyclist

middleagecyclist

Call me MAC
I do think that older people are worst simply because their eyesight goes - it's a fact, not being being ageist.
Oi! You can't just lump all us oldies together. How the very dare you?!

I've always needed corrected vision. Difference is when I was younger I wore glasses or contacts for myopia and astigmatism but for the last few yrs I've had just about perfect vision following laser surgery (£400.00 total for both eyes with Wavefront from Optimax courtesy of 4x deals from Tesco. One of the best decisions/investments i've ever made if anyone is interested).

You shouldn't just generalize!
 
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