Experiences of taking an ebike on a train?

[rogerzilla]

Yes, 25kg is the normal manual handling limit before you are supposed to get another person to help you (he says, looking at all those 38kg boxes of tiles he had to shift).

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

I remain of the opinion that it is fairly simple: look for the info plate and check it matches the bike at first glance. Most of the ones you need to worry about aren't even going to fake an info plate.

Some of them should be barred for having bulging or cracked batteries, whether or not they're attached to a legal bike.

The staff would see that as an argument with someone who is possibly a nutter

Yes - they can spot the dodgy ones in many cases
but if they try to stop someone getting on a train with it then if they are right then the "customer" is likely to argue

and they just don't want all the hassle that can cause

so they keep it very simple and easy to prove quickly and without having to check plates - which are probably available on the WWW anyway

mine is totally legal - but the plate looks like a sticker - allbeit a good one

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

Here you are

https://ebikesolution.co.uk/collections/stickers

so proves naff all really

 

[Drago]

The fake stickers that don't have a manufacturer are dodgier than Accy's mackerel and blackberry crumble. The Bafang one is more convincing. Train staff are neither trained nor paid to make an ID, so a blanket ban is then only practical method, as unsatisfactory as it may be.

As usual the law abiding suffer because a minority taken the p**s and the authorities are slow to act.

As an aside, those fake stickers are pointless. Possession of a false instrument with intent to deceive stands a good chance of a suspended sentencemif youre lucky. What kind of prat risks sharing a bedroom with bubba just to avoid a potential 6 points on a drivers licence they probably dont even have? Its like packing a machine gun because you dont want to get caught with a penknife.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

The fake stickers that don't have a manufacturer are dodgier than Accy's mackerel and blackberry crumble. The Bafang one is more convincing. Train staff are neither trained nor paid to make an ID, so a blanket ban is then only practical method, as unsatisfactory as it may be.

As usual the law abiding suffer because a minority taken the p**s and the authorities are slow to act.

As an aside, those fake stickers are pointless. Possession of a false instrument with intent to deceive stands a good chance of a suspended sentencemif youre lucky. What kind of prat risks sharing a bedroom with bubba just to avoid a potential 6 points on a drivers licence they probably dont even have? Its like packing a machine gun because you dont want to get caught with a penknife.

I do wonder what would happen if I was stopped by a Police check point

bike if legal and all that

but proving it would be a pain if plates - AKA stickers are easily available on the WWW and it appears that some of the Police told to do the stops are not as trained as they might be

I mean - I heard of one bike that was crushed because they lifted the back wheel up and spun the pedals and the speedo went up to 18 mph
therefore they decided the bike was not speed limited and it got crushed soon after

clearly the person checking them was not properly clear on the regs and how to test for them (i.e. motor actually running)

but there are also "single vehicle approval" things that allow a throttle
people with those would have real problems convincing them that their bike is OK!

I would support more checks - but how they can do them properly beats me!!

 

[Drago]

But as above, using a fake sticker might seem harmless but is almost a guarantee of a prison sentence, suspended if you're lucky and if your previous record permits.

Because its a deception offence it'll show on an enhanced DBS for all time, which is any job involving trust or responsibility forever close to you.

Whether the dibble are trained or not isn't really relevant - the downside of being caught using fake stickers or compliance plates is extreme, far worse than most people seem to realise. You can kill someone in a car and stand a reasonable chance of not going to prison, but the moment deception is involved you're stuffed. You're average untrained bobby is going to be far better at spotting fake stickers than they are the technical niceties of a legal EAPC.

To even consider it would be stupidity of the first order. It seems a harmless wheeze, but people don't seem to appreciatew what bad ju=ju any type of deception is in the eyes of the law.

 

[mjr]

and they just don't want all the hassle that can cause

Then they have no place in a safety-critical job on the railway! What other safety-critical orders they should give might they decide are too much hassle?

Also, why is a few arguments over fake plates any more hassle than lots more arguments over the irrational position of banning safe, legal e-bikes?

 

[classic33]

Then they have no place in a safety-critical job on the railway! What other safety-critical orders they should give might they decide are too much hassle?

Also, why is a few arguments over fake plates any more hassle than lots more arguments over the irrational position of banning safe, legal e-bikes?

If they can't be certain, and/or want to avoid any people having a go at their staff, the easiest way is to ban them all rather than have their barrier/revenue staff deciding who can or can't go through.

If they can't be certain about an items safety, they have the right to exclude it from their property. The same as any other site operator or service provider.

It's a knee jerk reaction that's been taking place over the last two years, up here at least.

 

[mjr]

The fake stickers that don't have a manufacturer are dodgier than Accy's mackerel and blackberry crumble. The Bafang one is more convincing. Train staff are neither trained nor paid to make an ID, so a blanket ban is then only practical method, as unsatisfactory as it may be.

Train staff are trained on what isn't allowed on, and they're generally pretty smart cookies, so I'm sure a simple recognition of legal e-bikes and unsafe ones or unsafe batteries isn't beyond them. They'll need training anyway to do a blanket ban, else we'll get stories of them incorrectly denying access to bikes with hub dynamos, USB chargers or electronic shifting.

Agree entirely that most fake stickers are unconvincing, but most of the riders of unsafe bikes aren't even going to bother to try.

 

[Drago]

Train staff are trained on what isn't allowed on,

According to my step brother who works kn the railways the trains g ranges from cant be arsed to non existent.

 

[Bazzer]

Just read in the Echo that all ebikes are banned from MerseyRail trains and stations
including the bike parking

Except folding ebikes
which is a pain - I can see why they don;t distinguish between "proper" ones and dodgy DIY ones - the staff can do without the arguments
and not "cool dude" would be seen dead on a folding ebike so they are less likely to be dodgy

but it is a pain

Which also shows some inconsistency, given Northern, Trans Pennine Express and Avanti West Coast, all of which operate and terminate in the Merseyrail area, all allow e bikes. - Albeit ones which are EAPC compliant.

 

[ebikeerwidnes]

I was wondering about some things so I checked and emailed Merseyrail customer services

Some of their documentation seemed to say that legal EAPC bike are OK - but apparently they are not except folding one
I reckon they need to update some online stuff - but it was rather in the back covered in msoss and weeds so I can see why.

I also checked about things like trains from Widnes - where I live

Basically they clarified that if the train is operated by another operator then it is up to that operator
I was worried about things like getting off at Liverpool Lime Street - apparently that is OK as the overground part of the station is operated by another group but you would not be allowed to take it down to the Underground platforms

I am not sure if there are any Merseyrail stations that also have other operators running from it - there maybe some on the Wirral - I seem to remember Chester has Merseyrail trains and others mixed up so I reckon you would be OK except for actually getting on the train

Putting this here in case it helps someone

 

[mjr]

I was wondering about some things so I checked and emailed Merseyrail customer services

Some of their documentation seemed to say that legal EAPC bike are OK - but apparently they are not except folding one [...]

Cycling UK asked Merseyrail for a meeting and to see the evidence behind this ban and were ignored, so now say they are "challenging this decision via our Cyclists’ Defence Fund (CDF). If you use your e-bike on Merseyrail and want to help us bin the blanket ban, donate to CDF at https://cyclinguk.org/merseyfail "

 

[N0bodyOfTheGoat]

I was wondering about some things so I checked and emailed Merseyrail customer services

Some of their documentation seemed to say that legal EAPC bike are OK - but apparently they are not except folding one
I reckon they need to update some online stuff - but it was rather in the back covered in msoss and weeds so I can see why.

I also checked about things like trains from Widnes - where I live

Basically they clarified that if the train is operated by another operator then it is up to that operator
I was worried about things like getting off at Liverpool Lime Street - apparently that is OK as the overground part of the station is operated by another group but you would not be allowed to take it down to the Underground platforms

I am not sure if there are any Merseyrail stations that also have other operators running from it - there maybe some on the Wirral - I seem to remember Chester has Merseyrail trains and others mixed up so I reckon you would be OK except for actually getting on the train

Putting this here in case it helps someone

I've not looked it up myself and don't know who do the trains, but my mum reckoned there's apparently a relatively new train service directly from around Prestatyn to Liverpool.

Are there really far less illegal folding ebikes than other styles?

 

[classic33]

I've not looked it up myself and don't know who do the trains, but my mum reckoned there's apparently a relatively new train service directly from around Prestatyn to Liverpool.

Are there really far less illegal folding ebikes than other styles?

The majority of illegal ones, being used mainly for food deliveries round here are folders. But, owing to extra batteries on them, there's nigh on no chance of folding them.