Genesis Croix de Fer

[benb]

I think Shimano have upped the official limit to 28 on the lastest medium cage mechs...

However I have an Ultegra 6500 medium cage mech, and I originally went to great lengths to make up a 9 speed 12-30 cassette (because Sheldon said such mechs could be "pushed" to 30 but not 32)

Then, the other day, out of interest, I tried a wheel fitted with an 9 speed 11-32 cassette (that is ultimately destined for a.n.other bike with a Deore long cage mech) Guess what - it worked perfectly.

A lot depends on the exact geometry of your bike. A while back I met someone who had a 10 speed Apex cassette (11-32) working with a medium cage Shimano mech - but he'd had to create a little right angle shim so he could the B screw adjusted right.

One thing you will need if you explore such arcane depths is a longer chain. If you inadvertently go big sprocket/big chainring with a chain that is too short you can jam the entire drive train with noisy and potentially expensive consequences.

Thanks for that. Sounds like it should be OK.
Presumably the downside to making the chain bigger, is that when you're in the smaller sprockets the chain is slack and flaps around a bit, and could possibly come off easily.

 

[jonathanw]

Works fine without changing rear mech. So far

 

[potsy]

How are you finding the Croix now you've had it a while Ben?
I was torn between the Tricross Elite disc and the Boardman CX, but the Genesis is starting to interest me again, think it's the steel frame and BB7's that are swaying me back to it

Can I ask what size tyres would it take, and is mudguard fitting simple or would they be a faff?

Cheers.

 

[benb]

How are you finding the Croix now you've had it a while Ben?
I was torn between the Tricross Elite disc and the Boardman CX, but the Genesis is starting to interest me again, think it's the steel frame and BB7's that are swaying me back to it

Can I ask what size tyres would it take, and is mudguard fitting simple or would they be a faff?

Cheers.

I love it. The steel frame is lovely and springy, and it goes fast! I guess it's not quite as quick as a "pure" road bike, but it suits me well.

I swapped out the stock tyres with Conti Gatorskins 25mm. It would probably be OK with thinner ones, but check.

I haven't fitted guards, but it has the mountings for them, so there shouldn't be a problem.

 

[benb]

Works fine without changing rear mech. So far

Think I might take your lead and get a new cassette then.

Did you have to change the chain for a longer one?

 

[potsy]

Cheers Ben, I was thinking more of going 32 or 35 on the tyres, with some semi-slicks and using it as a general go anywhere bike.
Have discovered I really like getting off the road every now and then on the commute, and a bike like that would be great.

Would need the guards though, not a fan of getting myself dirty, not bothered if the bike looks like it's been rolling around in the mud though

My lbs doesn't do Genesis which is a shame, but will seek one out soon,.

 

[PpPete]

Thanks for that. Sounds like it should be OK.
Presumably the downside to making the chain bigger, is that when you're in the smaller sprockets the chain is slack and flaps around a bit, and could possibly come off easily.

Not exactly flaps around.... what you need to make sure is, having got the length of chain right so that it will "just" accomodate an inadvertent big/big combination, that should you inadvertently go small/small the mech won't fold up too far on itself and bring everything to a grinding halt.

Hopefully you will never cross-chain when you are riding, but my very strong recommedation would be to check out all the possible combinations whilst the bike is on the workstand. Add/remove links or adjust the B screw until you get ALL the combinations to work.

Why?

Well you can bet that if you don't, one day, on a long ride, you will be tired, not concentrating on your gears, thinking about whether that pothole that used to be around the next bend has got bigger or been repaired, dreaming about that pint & plate of chips you've promised yourself when you get to the pub.....and CRUNCH ! You realise too late that you went into that one combination that doesnt work and you've now FUBAR'd a mech, and will now spend an hour jury-rigging a single-speed to get you home, or be calling taxi.

How do I know this ? Don't ask....

 

[benb]

Not exactly flaps around.... what you need to make sure is, having got the length of chain right so that it will "just" accomodate an inadvertent big/big combination, that should you inadvertently go small/small the mech won't fold up too far on itself and bring everything to a grinding halt.

Hopefully you will never cross-chain when you are riding, but my very strong recommedation would be to check out all the possible combinations whilst the bike is on the workstand. Add/remove links or adjust the B screw until you get ALL the combinations to work.

Why?

Well you can bet that if you don't, one day, on a long ride, you will be tired, not concentrating on your gears, thinking about whether that pothole that used to be around the next bend has got bigger or been repaired, dreaming about that pint & plate of chips you've promised yourself when you get to the pub.....and CRUNCH ! You realise too late that you went into that one combination that doesnt work and you've now FUBAR'd a mech, and will now spend an hour jury-rigging a single-speed to get you home, or be calling taxi.

How do I know this ? Don't ask....

Thanks for that. I guess a chain too short for a big-big is worse than a chain too long for a small-small.
Well I've ordered a 11-32 and if it doesn't work I'm blaming Jonathanw

 

[jonathanw]

Too much responsibility!!!!!!
I put a new chain on anyway, and yes it did need a bit lengthening. I also adjusted the b screw in a bit too
I cannot use large large combo, but rarely ever do, but I suspect it could potentially be fatal to the rear mech if tried.
Still, the small chainring and 32 combo is amazing on the hills
J

 

[jonathanw]

SKS chromoplastic 35-38mm mudguards a little diddly to fit but worth the effort.
Slicks are - marathon racer 30mm; and the 35mm marathon winters with studs just fit under them too.

 

[benb]

Too much responsibility!!!!!!
I put a new chain on anyway, and yes it did need a bit lengthening. I also adjusted the b screw in a bit too
I cannot use large large combo, but rarely ever do, but I suspect it could potentially be fatal to the rear mech if tried.
Still, the small chainring and 32 combo is amazing on the hills
J

Can you elaborate on what you did with the b screw - I haven't done any fiddling with the rear mech, so need a bit of hand-holding.

Cheers.

 

[benb]

Maybe I should play it safe and buy a long cage rear mech?

 

[jonathanw]

You should be ok if you make sure the chain is long enough. Adjusting the B screw inwards will move the derailleur away from the cassette so that the first jockey wheel does not contact the cogs. Try it on the stand before spending £40 on a replacement 105 medium cage dérailleur. I deliberately made the chain too short for the 11-32 so that I could interchange both wheelsets with the same chain. If the 11-32 is for keeps then the correct chain length with the b screw adjusted should allow you to cross chain to use every gear, although I wouldn't do it myself. If iota doesn't work on the Reike stand you can always fit the larger derailleur. There are loads of videos on you tube which show you how.

 

[jonathanw]

You should be ok if you make sure the chain is long enough. Adjusting the B screw inwards will move the derailleur away from the cassette so that the first jockey wheel does not contact the cogs. Try it on the stand before spending £40 on a replacement 105 medium cage dérailleur. I deliberately made the chain too short for the 11-32 so that I could interchange both wheelsets with the same chain. If the 11-32 is for keeps then the correct chain length with the b screw adjusted should allow you to cross chain to use every gear, although I wouldn't do it myself. If it doesn't work on the stand you can always fit the larger derailleur. There are loads of videos on you tube which show you how.

 

[benb]

Thanks Jonathan, I'll let you know how I get on.

Although I never use big-big I think I'll make the chain long enough, in case I select that by mistake.