Genesis Tour de Fer 30.

[chriswoody]

Just some rambling thoughts of my own based on the excellent posts above.

Back in 2016, Kona had the traditional Sutra tourer in their line up, with a steel frame, Shimano 3x9 groupset, mudguards, racks, Brooks B17 saddle and mechanical disc brakes all as standard. They also wanted to get into the new Gravel/Adventure/Off-road touring/Bikepacking game as well, so decided to take the bare Sutra frame and completely change the components to create a completely different bike, the Sutra LTD. The Sutra LTD had a SRAM 1x11 groupset with hydraulic disc brakes, short stem, wide flared drop bars and tubeless ready wheels. A completely different beast of a bike, but built off of exactly the same frame as the normal Sutra. The Sutra LTD also has all the fittings for racks and mudguards, alongside lots of other mounts for cages so making it quite a versatile bike.

My Sutra LTD has now covered over 1400 kilometres, mostly off-road, in bikepacking mode and been subtly modded for more comfort by adding a Brooks C17 saddle, wider more flared drop bars, tubeless 47mm tires and more powerful Hope brake calipers. It's probably the one bike I'd really struggle to sell, it's such a delight to ride.

All the above is an attempt to say, whilst you probably can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse, a good bike can be modded and changed to create just the perfect type of bike for you. So whilst nothing beats New Bike Day, maybe a different approach is to look at what you have and create your perfect bike with just a few changes.

Oh and Kona still have the original Sutra in their line up, resplendent with 3x9, bar end shifters and all.

 

[Petrichorwheels]

I don't like that they dropped the bike that established them - The LHT.
I know there's a disc version but I'm not a disc man. I may be mistaken but I don't think they do the Disc version with 26 inch wheels either.

I don't like that they now seem to have a stable of models that can be dropped suddenly. Like the LHT or the Ogre. At one time I seriously considered upgrading to an Ogre as the ultimate, every-option-possible, go-anywhere bike.

It's been a while but the last time I visited their site it was full of crap. I don't want to buy Surly merchandise and not terribly impressed by a company that produces it. I'm a consumer, not a fan.

To my mind they've become trendy and I must be getting old but that doesn't sit well with me because bikes for touring must be the unsexiest, least trendy type of bike.
(Touring in this sense is the loaded variety. Bikepacking is exciting and sexy and trendy).

Then there's the prices which have jumped with a reduction in quality of components. But I said I'd leave that out of the discussion.

To my way of thinking a bike is for life and I'd expect to have a lifetime relationship with the company. I'd prefer a stable entity like SJS/Thorn than Surly.
I believe Spa are good too although I've no direct experience.
And after a recent Frenchman's rant (on these fora) about Sonder I might consider them too.
Koga are huge in NL but I think a lot of their bikes now are aluminium and Stephen/John Peel formerly of this parish set off on a custom Rohloff equipped Koga and had to return to the UK from France after undiagnosed incompatibility between frame and Rohloff. (If memory serves correctly, Rohloff changed something and Koga didn't make the necessary adjustments to the frame). The service from Koga left a lot to be desired. I'd expect a well established Touring Bike company to be more on the ball and to not require a return to the original dealer.
By comparison, I smashed my SON dynohub - totally my own fault - during the Pandemic. When I could make contact with an agent (abroad) I had a replacement inside of a week! To the other side of the world. Free.

That's my type of company.

A Rohloff equipped bike like the OP is considering is in the ballpark of 4k, 4.5? If I'm spending that I want a good feeling about the company.

That's just me.

I ride a 25 year old runt of the Trek litter. What do I know?

Ta for answer hobbes.
Confirms my ideas