Gillstay
Über Member
Oddly though that is bending the wrong way for how my hands are comfortable.
Got a new hybrid it’s better than my road bike
- Thread starter Leemi1982
- Start date
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raleighnut
Legendary Member
- Location
- One of the 'Elite'
I hold them from the outside with my thumbs pointing forwards along the top so my wrists are straight.
The OP mentions they've travelled further on the hybrid, but not nec. faster. In their purest forms it would be to be expected that the road bike would be better at covering short distances faster (aero sacrificed over comfort), and the hybrid potentially better at longer distances traversed (potentially much) slower.
I suspect the differences here are down to geometry; which can be compared by measuring the effective reach and stack of each bike at the contact points on the bars (if anyone's arsed I'll explain how); then they can be compared. I suspect the road bike will have significantly more reach and / or less stack; meaning the rider is more stretched out and will become uncomfortable quicker.
Care should also be paid to the saddle height - this should generally be consistant for the rider regardless of bike / application (MTBs and their need to keep the saddle out of the way for moving around on the bike notwithstanding) and this could just be a case of the saddle being incorrectly adjusted on the road bike.
Once the saddle height's sorted (I like the "leg is straight when heel's on the pedal" method myself), since the hybrid currently seems to be the closest to optimum I'd look to adjust the road bike's bars / stem so that the reach and stack of the tops of the bars themselves (concentric with the bit that's clamped by the stem) are the same / very close to those on the hybrid - so you'll have the same, comfortable position on the tops, and can always go to the drops / hoods for shorter periods for a more efficient position.
One final possibility is that the faster handling of the road bike (thanks to its shorter wheelbase, narrower bars and more aggressive geometry) is tiring the OP out through the need for constant steering correction; in which case the hybrid is probably the better option full stop.
I suspect the differences here are down to geometry; which can be compared by measuring the effective reach and stack of each bike at the contact points on the bars (if anyone's arsed I'll explain how); then they can be compared. I suspect the road bike will have significantly more reach and / or less stack; meaning the rider is more stretched out and will become uncomfortable quicker.
Care should also be paid to the saddle height - this should generally be consistant for the rider regardless of bike / application (MTBs and their need to keep the saddle out of the way for moving around on the bike notwithstanding) and this could just be a case of the saddle being incorrectly adjusted on the road bike.
Once the saddle height's sorted (I like the "leg is straight when heel's on the pedal" method myself), since the hybrid currently seems to be the closest to optimum I'd look to adjust the road bike's bars / stem so that the reach and stack of the tops of the bars themselves (concentric with the bit that's clamped by the stem) are the same / very close to those on the hybrid - so you'll have the same, comfortable position on the tops, and can always go to the drops / hoods for shorter periods for a more efficient position.
One final possibility is that the faster handling of the road bike (thanks to its shorter wheelbase, narrower bars and more aggressive geometry) is tiring the OP out through the need for constant steering correction; in which case the hybrid is probably the better option full stop.
Gillstay
Über Member
Thats where your missing the point for myself. Its not the same position on the tops as tops are straight but with a hybrid bike they can be hooked back so your hands are more at say 45% position. If that makes sense.
On drops I use all the different positions as none are comfortable for long, unlike say a Dutch bike.
Not quite sure what you're getting at tbh (difficult to visualise) but I appreciate there are functional differences between both types of bars. Might be that you're more comfortable with a wider bar too...
Bottom line I much prefer drops for many reasons, but granted they're not nec. right for everyone.
End of the day if it works for you...
Twilkes
Guru
38mph is about a cadence of 100rpm in a 53/11 gear, which is a lot. If you could do this on flat bars what do you think was stopping you doing it on drop bars?
GuyBoden
Guru
- Location
- Warrington
I had a nice Ridgeback flight 4 for a few years, which had flatbars. On longer rides of 5+ hours I got numbness in my hands due to the limited hand positions on flat bars. I tried different barend grips, longer/shorter stems, but I still got numb hands after longer rides. I've never got numb hands on dropbars, due to the multiple hand positions available, so I'm sticking with dropbars from now on. 
Twilkes
Guru
I had a nice Ridgeback flight 4 for a few years, which had flatbars. On longer rides of 5+ hours I got numbness in my hands due to the limited hand positions on flat bars. I tried different barend grips, longer/shorter stems, but I still got numb hands after longer rides. I've never got numb hands on dropbars, due to the multiple hand positions available, so I'm sticking with dropbars from now on.
For anyone looking for a different hand position on flat bars, TOGS are worth a try. I have some inside of the grips on my hybrid, and it lets me lie my hands over the top of the bars with the thumb hooked over, can help to change the angle of the forearm too so it's more like a 'hoods' position. Might not be for everyone, but I used to grip over the top of the shifters on my hybrid which was good for a rest but not very secure, these just help keep my hands in place.
https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topic/togs/
Gillstay
Über Member
So you dont need to expand your hand all the way around the grip to maintain a decent grip. I can understand that working. Would never have thought to invent such a thing.
PaulSB
Legendary Member
- Location
- Chorley, Lancashire
Apologies but could you explain some more please. I can't get my head round why one would need to hook one's thumbs in this way?
Dangerous? Having thumbs in like this surely makes them vulnerable to breaking in a crash? We're taught to rest our thumbs on a car steering wheel for the same reason......at least in my day we were.
Twilkes
Guru
It's just a different hand position, more akin to the hoods on drop bars. It can put the forearms in a more natural position (they often feel twisted on flat bars) and can take the pressure off the parts of the hands that are usually in contact with the grips. Your hands are more likely to bounce off the bars than break your thumbs in an incident, but it's pretty quick to get you thumb back underneath if you think something might be about to happen. They're more for cruising or climbing than for using all the time, and you still have access to the brakes which you wouldn't get with traditional bar ends.
https://www.mtbr.com/threads/review-togs-thumb-over-grip-system.1170025/
GuyBoden
Guru
- Location
- Warrington
Drop bar ends are always an option, they should have enough hand positions to avoid the numb hands syndrome on long rides.
Inability to breathe and a back pain, and being too scared of narrow bars.
First two where down to poor bike fit, my "flat" bars were raiser bars to mitigate unobtainability(is it even a word?) of higher stem. And it was '82 or '83 vintage with 630mm rim and tall 1_1/4" tyres.
Now, 20 years on I did have a seat on a road(relaxed geometry) bike and I think I could live with that, with cross levers.
antnee
Guru
- Location
- Weston Super mud, North Somerset
Well getting back to the first post reference of flat bar bikes and road bikes (Drop handle bars) Aerodynamics surely comes into play with this, Though perusing the post, I would surely recommend a bike fit or someone more who knows perhaps more about bikes than yourself. I would still attempt to set up the road bike to your statue so as others have suggested the flat bar bike was more suited to your build than the road bike was.
Paul_Smith SRCC
www.plsmith.co.uk
- Location
- Surrey UK
Not sure if the OP is still following this post but here is my ten pence worth.
Yes the Trek Fx 2 flat bar straight bar bike is something of a 'wolf in sheep's' clothing and for many it's closer performance wise to the Specialized Allez than you may expect, plus there may well be a 'tortoise and the hare' effect on a more comfortable set up. But, personally I would check the 'bike fit' on the Allez, every bike is the sum of it's parts and that includes the bike fit, yes reaching longer and lower to a drop bar bike will for some not be as comfortable as a shorter higher reach on a straight bat set up, but you shouldn't be reaching a conclusion that after 10 miles you have had enough.
Perhaps take a picture of both bikes side on and post them on this thread incase anything is clearly visible. The first thing I'd check on a drop bar bike with a standard seat tube angle to match (normally around 73 degrees on a 56cm) is to make sure the saddle is not set forward on the rails, if someone is struggling with the reach I often see that they move the saddle forward to reduce the reach, although this may seem logical in effect it tips the rider forward increasing weight on their hands and arms, it can feel a bit like you are doing 'a plank' on your bike, although the reach is reduced it often results in less comfort; which the rider will describe in just the same way the OP has.
You will often see this very topic discussed as 'Saddle setback', 'Kops' (and the myth of Kops) or 'BMR (Body mass representation)'; there are quite a few useful online examples of how to set up your position, I have attached just one example that you may find useful. Note if one area of the 'fit' is wrong it can throw aspects of the set up out as well.
Yes the Trek Fx 2 flat bar straight bar bike is something of a 'wolf in sheep's' clothing and for many it's closer performance wise to the Specialized Allez than you may expect, plus there may well be a 'tortoise and the hare' effect on a more comfortable set up. But, personally I would check the 'bike fit' on the Allez, every bike is the sum of it's parts and that includes the bike fit, yes reaching longer and lower to a drop bar bike will for some not be as comfortable as a shorter higher reach on a straight bat set up, but you shouldn't be reaching a conclusion that after 10 miles you have had enough.
Perhaps take a picture of both bikes side on and post them on this thread incase anything is clearly visible. The first thing I'd check on a drop bar bike with a standard seat tube angle to match (normally around 73 degrees on a 56cm) is to make sure the saddle is not set forward on the rails, if someone is struggling with the reach I often see that they move the saddle forward to reduce the reach, although this may seem logical in effect it tips the rider forward increasing weight on their hands and arms, it can feel a bit like you are doing 'a plank' on your bike, although the reach is reduced it often results in less comfort; which the rider will describe in just the same way the OP has.
You will often see this very topic discussed as 'Saddle setback', 'Kops' (and the myth of Kops) or 'BMR (Body mass representation)'; there are quite a few useful online examples of how to set up your position, I have attached just one example that you may find useful. Note if one area of the 'fit' is wrong it can throw aspects of the set up out as well.
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