Half Cyclist????

[sanoffyhighstepson]

I always admired Magnatom for the courage it took to make his videos and display them, even though I didnt agree with the way he portrayed himself. But now I cycle more than I have ever done (in a bid to erradicate the spare Pirelli at waist level) and see why he gets annoyed.
I used to drive buses and gave cyclists adequate room on the road even if my limited knowledge on cycling left me puzzled as to why you guys sat in the middle of a lane.
But now (and here comes the plugging bit) I have started my own car servicing company " www.mckayscarservices.weebly.com " and instead of using my car to price jobs, wasting valuable and costly fuel, I use my newly acquired steed. Earns me money in the long run and gets me fit. The reason I'm only a half cyclist is because I havent quite managed to ride along with my 2 tonne jack, axle stands, toolbox, jump leads................

Car drivers do car tests and know very little about cycling. Some cyclists who have not done a car test may have limited knowledge on most aspects of road using.
I think that all people who plan on using a road should be taught basic stuff about how other road users may react to different situations. Then the roads may become a safer place because everyone might just understand each other.

What do you think????

 

[Arch]

I think you're right, it would be much better if everyone understood each other's needs better. How to do that, is tricky. Start at school perhaps?

I also think, for work, maybe you need a Maximus

 

[mickle]

The huge funds going into cycle training in schools at the moment will result in a whole generation of proficient cyclists in a few years time.

The fact remains though that cyclists along with pedestrians and equestrians are entitled to use the roads whereas motorists are merely licenced. The attitude of many drivers, including lots of perfectly nice, decent law abiding people is that somehow motorists own the roads. There is still a widely held belief that the payment of 'road tax' gives them more rights than other road users. I know of no other country where cyclists, as a group, are held in such low regard. They at once expect us to abide by the rules of the road and treat us as if we aren't entitled to be there. Ride on the pavement through a red light without lights elsewhere in the world and no-one bats an eyelid. The cyclist is someone simply getting about, as long as they hurt no-one there are no issues. Do the same in this country and expect a telling off by the nearest concerned citizen. Many members of this forum will be familiar with the feeling of being considered the 'wacky' one in the office, simply for riding a bicycle.

It's not cyclists attitudes which need addressing so much as the general population.

 

[domtyler]

The good thing about London is that it is not seen as whacky any more. There really are loads of us about nowadays.

 

[summerdays]

Start at school perhaps?

The huge funds going into cycle training in schools at the moment will result in a whole generation of proficient cyclists in a few years time.

Although schools start the process off, half the kids will hardly cycle their bikes after they do their cycle training. My eldest (who has done her CP) only ever rides her bike if we do something as a family outting, when she is fine doing it. But do it on her own as a means of getting about ... she would rather walk. I'm hoping the other two will be keener since they were younger when we started to cycle alot.

But hopefully even if those children don't continue to cycle they will have an increased understanding of other road users.

 

[sanoffyhighstepson]

Thats the problem these days, as soon as they hit their teens its all Playstations or Buckfast!!! Bad!!!
Then again, getting taught something like cycling in school is good. But how many people remember algebra from school. Bet its half'n'half there!!!
Refreshers may be good at certain ages though???

 

[beanzontoast]

The huge funds going into cycle training in schools at the moment will result in a whole generation of proficient cyclists in a few years time.

The fact remains though that cyclists along with pedestrians and equestrians are entitled to use the roads whereas motorists are merely licenced. The attitude of many drivers, including lots of perfectly nice, decent law abiding people is that somehow motorists own the roads. There is still a widely held belief that the payment of 'road tax' gives them more rights than other road users. I know of no other country where cyclists, as a group, are held in such low regard. They at once expect us to abide by the rules of the road and treat us as if we aren't entitled to be there. Ride on the pavement through a red light without lights elsewhere in the world and no-one bats an eyelid. The cyclist is someone simply getting about, as long as they hurt no-one there are no issues. Do the same in this country and expect a telling off by the nearest concerned citizen. Many members of this forum will be familiar with the feeling of being considered the 'wacky' one in the office, simply for riding a bicycle.

It's not cyclists attitudes which need addressing so much as the general population.

I think you underestimate the 'natural' progression that has been a part of society for many years i.e. ride a bike until you are old enough / can afford a car, then drive a car. Cycling training for schools has been around for donkey's years. Why should things change now?

 

[BentMikey]

I would think that most cyclists are drivers and have driven a car. There does seem to be this weird perception that cyclists can't afford cars, are green eco-warriors, and are generally poor, when on average the reverse is true.

 

[beanzontoast]

I would think that most cyclists are drivers and have driven a car. There does seem to be this weird perception that cyclists can't afford cars, are green eco-warriors, and are generally poor, when on average the reverse is true.

True - and the converse thing is that most drivers were once cyclists, but aren't any more. Why not? Because they prefer driving (for convenience/because of distance/because of loads they have to carry/because they just like it/for comfort in all weathers - there are endless reasons), even in congested streets and given the mounting cost of fuel etc, to cycling.

I've done cycling training in schools over several years and alone it will not produce a generation of people who prefer cycling to driving. What it does produce is safer young cyclists.

 

[mickle]

I think you underestimate the 'natural' progression that has been a part of society for many years i.e. ride a bike until you are old enough / can afford a car, then drive a car. Cycling training for schools has been around for donkey's years. Why should things change now?

Because it's better now. It's not some bloke turning up @ the school having a shout @ the children then effing off. There's a lorra lorra money going into it. Right now.

 

[beanzontoast]

Because it's better now. It's not some bloke turning up @ the school having a shout @ the children then effing off. There's a lorra lorra money going into it. Right now.

I agree that the quality of training is better. I don't think that fundamental attitudes to car ownership are changed by cycle training though. Though the numbers of cyclists may increase in the future (and not everyone agrees that they will) the car is going to remain an aspirational object for the majority of young people for many years to come.

 

[sanoffyhighstepson]

Thats the problem these days, GENERALISATION!!
Many people dont treat others with respect and to say that all cyclist are good is not true. To say that all drivers are good is also not true.
To say that the training drivers and cyclists recieve is adequate, regardless of age it is recieved at, is also not true.
The only way to tackle this disease that is "lack of respect and knowledge" is to have proper training at reasonable intervals and ages.

 

[hubgearfreak]

Car drivers do car tests and know very little about cycling.

however, car drivers need to know and obey the highway code...you know stuff like being cautious and considerate around more vulnerable road users. giving plenty of space when overtaking cyclists and equestrian types. etc.

that some don't is where the problem lies. not with cyclists

some cyclists are their own worst enemies, riding in dark clothes, riding in the gutter, & etc., but even this is only a problem because some motorists aren't cautious or concentrating

 

[Night Train]

I think it is easy for any one group of road users to blame another and it seems that each has their own reasoning for why others are worse road users as a generalisation.

It is true that many motorists did cycle at some point and many cyclist do motor sometimes. The problem comes when one forgets the needs and limitations of others over time due to lack of familiarity or a 'don't care' attitude.

I would be in favour of some sort of training before venturing out off the pavement onto the roads with any sort of transport system and then adding a regular retraining/retesting as suitable.

I walk, cycle sometimes, have used a motorbike, use a car regularly and occasionally drive a truck and when I am really lucky I will ride a horse. Each has a different type of need and ability to be able to do it well and safely and it is often difficult to see or realise why certain behaviour on the roads may cause a problem for another road user. I suppose some modes of transport reduces road awareness more then others and it can then be difficult to keep that awareness raised without it seeming as over the top safety publicity.

Maybe when drivers of all motor vehicles cycle more often, and in traffic, then it will get better for cyclists overall. Maybe if we all had to drive a truck sometimes we'd be more understanding of the lack of visibility and the space they need for turning and stopping. I've seen many road users who seem to forget that horses have a brain of their own that is not entirely in the rider's control.

 

[sanoffyhighstepson]

however, car drivers need to know and obey the highway code...you know stuff like being cautious and considerate around more vulnerable road users. giving plenty of space when overtaking cyclists and equestrian types. etc.

that some don't is where the problem lies. not with cyclists

some cyclists are their own worst enemies, riding in dark clothes, riding in the gutter, & etc., but even this is only a problem because some motorists aren't cautious or concentrating

Geez Louise!!! Cyclists only have the problem of inconsiderate drivers because of their choice of attire??? Nope!!
Pretty narrow minded view!! We are aiming for the bigger picture here. No Bias!!
Yes, car users need to eradicate this "we are here cos we pay for it" attitude. But cyclist also need to eradicate the "feel sorry for us cos were only small" attitude too.
Some, not all drivers go through red lights, as do some, not all cyclists. Some, not all drivers wander all over the road with no lane discipline, as do some, not all, cyclists wander all over the road.
Yes, drivers can cause a lot of damage by hitting a cyclist. I agree with that. But what damage would acrue if a car had to swerve to avoid a cyclist who did not obey rules of the road???
To point fingers at one party is not a way forward, but a step back.
It works both ways. Cyclists and car users must learn to live with each other and realise that one is not more important or more entitled to be on the road than the other.