Headset bearings

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robgul

Legendary Member
Headset bearings are unique to bicycles. They were invented to solve a very specific engineering problem that doesn't occur with any other bearing application I can think of. Can you cite an example where headset bearings are used other than in bicycles?

Ah - my comment was slightly ambiguous - what I meant was that you could certainly buy cycle bearings other than from specific cycle bearing emporia (we have a bearing supplier locally that stocks quite a few bike compatible bearings - headset, BB & wheels)

I believe that there some "mobile benches/cradles" used by car plants that have wheels in a bike-fork-like set up that use headset style bearings.

Rob
 

Globalti

Legendary Member
The OP is going through what every bike owner who takes care of their bike has to suffer - the nightmare of sourcing the right bearings. Once you've found them, buy two if you plan to keep the bike, make a careful note of the size and grease the bearing well before refitting it. Most bikes are designed to be ridden in places like warm sunny California not wet muddy Britain.
 
Location
Loch side.
Ah - my comment was slightly ambiguous - what I meant was that you could certainly buy cycle bearings other than from specific cycle bearing emporia (we have a bearing supplier locally that stocks quite a few bike compatible bearings - headset, BB & wheels)

There is a reason why bearings have a course of its own in mechanical engineering school. They are quite complex. Complex to design for, complex to source and complex to diagnose when failing prematurely.

You say you have a bearing shop that stocks compatible bearings for bike wheels, headsets and BBs. I don't doubt what you say, I just wonder whether they don't just stock bike bearings as well as automotive/engineering bearings. The two are very seldom the same.

For instance, the code itself - say 6085, only gives dimensions. An alphabetic suffix, say ZZ, tells you there are two steel dust seals on that bearing and a RR tells you there are two rubbers seals of a specific type of rubber. LLB seals would be a different type of rubber. These vary depending on the temperature and/or contaminants they will come into contact with.

Then there are suffixes for grease type and grease volume. A bearing could have as little grease as 10% or as much as 90% of interior cavity.

On a bike's rear hub where there could be as many as 6 cartridge bearings, you don't want 90% fill because then the freewheel wouldn't freewheel, it would continually turn and wind the chain up.

Yet, the 10% and 90% fill bearings are both nominally 6085 (or whatever).

Bike suspension requires full-fill bearings. This is because these bearings don't rotate, they oscillate, and quickly become grease-starved.

Bearing companies typically just look at the first four numbers and hand over what looks compatible.

Further, I can't see how they can supply BB bearings (if we're talking cartridges here) because those are non-standard and made specially for Shimano or Campag, even though they have industry standard number designations. For instance, Shimano is, say a 6085, but if you compare, you'll find that the Shimano bearing is 1mm narrower than industry standard. I suspect they simply use the seal that fits the diameter and have never made new ones specially for Shimano.

I believe that there some "mobile benches/cradles" used by car plants that have wheels in a bike-fork-like set up that use headset style bearings.

Rob

I can't picture those but it sounds to me like it is just a trolley made from bicycle parts. Or something designed around existing bicycle parts.

Headset bearings are unique. They were invented by the bike industry for the bike industry. The inventor of the threadless headset designed the first ACBs (angular contact bearings) for headsets and took a patent on it back in the early 1990s. These bearings are intended to move inside their frame sockets to prevent dimpling. They are not intended to press-fit and will rotate at the outer race when used in rotational applications such as motors.

The patent holder was Aheadset, a company later bought by Cane Creek. This bearing revolutionised bike forks.

I have not seen this adopted anywhere else in industry, but I don't see everything. I am not Argus.

These bearings are not in the SKF, NTS, Timken or IKO catalogues. They are in FSA and Cane Creek catalogues.
 

Dogtrousers

Kilometre nibbler
Didn't Graham obree try using other bearings?
:smile:
IIRC Obree's use of repurposed washing machine bearings was for the bottom bracket, not the headset, as he was trying to get as narrow a BB as possible.

I must say this thread is confusing. Since I got my Posh New Bike with a FancyModern (TM) headset I've always just taken it to the LBS when it needs attention. I can still deal with my hubs as they still have ye olde balle bearings but that's about it.
 
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gazza81

gazza81

Über Member
Location
Edenbridge
I have looked at cane creek but some of them cost more than the bikes worth!!
I dont need the whole headset just the 2 bearings.
I actually did what someone else recommended and gave them a good clean and the bottom one is much better but unfortunately the bearing cage broke on the top one so definitely need to replace

Ive found both online separate places totdl of £25 which is a bout as much as id want to pay i think
 
Fortunately all of the headsets on my bikes are FSA. All I have to remember is which FSA headset number goes on each bike. I then buy the full headset, and keep the bits I don’t need right now as spares. It saves messing around.
 
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gazza81

gazza81

Über Member
Location
Edenbridge
Blimey are you sure you bought a bike or just a collection of scrap metal parts bolted together?

Seems that way!

Why on earth have you just not been along to your LBS with the bearings and ask for their help?

I refuse to go lbs now after them being utterly useless previous 2 times.
I have a halford and a evans, had problems with both but both are aso 1hr round trip (live in middle of nowhere)!
Then one other which is super expensive family run and unfortunately i dont have deep pockets. Not for old bikes like this one anyway.

I bought is as it was cheap and thought it would do me this yr untill i can put some money aside for a new one!

If the plastic cage broke you don't have to throw the bearing away, just stick the balls back in with grease and reassemble it. You can refurbish that bearing as long as the races aren't too badly damaged:


View: https://youtu.be/buy80Fj-Afg


Brilliant i will try this thank you!
 

That’s fine, if you have a cup / loose ( cage )bearing / race, type of arrangement. But I think the OP has the sort of set up with sealed cartridge ACBs. Also, there is a limit to how bad the one’s your Your YouTube link can get, before you need to get the whole lot replaced.
This is the ( FSA number 10 ) headset, that I had to replace a couple of weeks ago on my Hybrid.
501461



501462


It’s the type of arrangement in the linked clip, and no amount of regreasing, and replacement bearings was going to help:laugh:.
 
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gazza81

gazza81

Über Member
Location
Edenbridge
Ive got the same as in that video unfortunately the rubber cage that holds the ball bearings snapped I chucked it in the bin so I can't try and refurbished that one anyway

I have seen some ball bearings in metal cages for a couple of quid I wonder if I could just fit them
 
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gazza81

gazza81

Über Member
Location
Edenbridge
Right bought a couple bearings, but i just got them off ebay as want to keep it cheap, ive already spent more than the bikes worth!

I bought 2 new bearings and just used the old headset washers and bits

There is a slight gap, is this ok/normal?
Im sure it was there before too
502603
 
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