How well known is cyclechat outside of the cyclechat community?

[classic33]

this place started out in 2005 and was inhabited by a few sheep and a unicycling cat.

the popular cycling plus forum morphed into bike radar, which resulted in the mass exodus of disgruntled punters in 2007 who found this place and and had enough of a critical mass to make it their own.

other forums came and went (notably another cycling forum), and this forum has grown with the increase in interest in cycling that extends beyond the pre-2012 cycling subculture.

most social media was in its infancy in 2007, so the fact that the forum is not only surviving but thriving is testament to site owner, moderators and, more importantly, users, who keep the good ship running in good order…

Where'd the cat go?

 

[alecstilleyedye]

Where'd the cat go?

in charge of the velominati...

 

[Bollo]

2nd, are British Cycling missing a trick by thinking that cycling and the promotion of cycling revolves around the traditional club structure while in reality it is possible that a lot more cycling activity takes place 'under the radar' organised via forums, facebook groups and other informal collections?

I’m only involved loosely with BC as a volunteer so can only speak of my experiences; I’m not claiming to be the font of all knowledge.
My biggest criticism of BC is that it’s overly bureaucratic and tends to be very inward-looking and centralised. If you asked a club secretary or chairman, they’ll likely tell you that BC doesn’t do much for them either.

BCs current social efforts are a mixed bag. Locally at least the Breeze rides are more successful than the Let’s Ride schemes. BC have their own websites to manage these and don’t seem to want to exploit channels outside of their own fiefdom.

Also, I think the change of sponsorship has hurt the BC social rides. Whatever you think about Sky, they were very good at branding and promotion. I get the feeling that the sponsorship deal with HSBC was just a sack of cash and the Pantone colours for the logo.

 

[I like Skol]

You're also youth secretary of a club you boob.

But we got no yoof yet so until we do i dont think i can fairly put that position on my CV?

this place started out in 2005 and was inhabited by a few sheep and a unicycling cat.

the popular cycling plus forum morphed into bike radar, which resulted in the mass exodus of disgruntled punters in 2007 who found this place and and had enough of a critical mass to make it their own.

other forums came and went (notably another cycling forum), and this forum has grown with the increase in interest in cycling that extends beyond the pre-2012 cycling subculture.

most social media was in its infancy in 2007, so the fact that the forum is not only surviving but thriving is testament to site owner, moderators and, more importantly, users, who keep the good ship running in good order…

That is just history, but does raise a good point. For a site that has been around a good while, survived storm & tempest and apparently has a healthy membership, how can it be so unknown in its area of existence (the cycling community)?

If I might answer your questions with two more questions...

How many members does CC have?

How many members does British Cycling have?

How many actively visiting and recent joiners of CC? A total number of members is pointless if most of them signed up years ago and have not been seen or heard from since? In fact, won't the forum management have to start deleting the details of dormant members now, under GDPR (not that i pretend to understand the implications of GDPR and its implementation).
I guess BC membership is annual so they know exactly how many members they have at any point, and as they are also selling you a service almost on a commercial basis it isnt really comparable.

If the forum were more well known then it might help get more women into cycling.

Is cyclechat more or less welcoming to females than other organisations or cycle groups (I am aware that this point alone is potentially a whole different thread that would descend to the depths and be locked very quickly!)? I personally see forum members as cycling enthusiasts rather than male or female (unless a member strongly identifies as a particular gender) so i am perhaps not well placed or observant enough to be a judge of this.

 

[classic33]

Maybe it not being known outside as well as the CTC or BC, is down to a lack of a physical presence.

 

[Pat "5mph"]

So does this mean that cycling clubs still hold the key for access to organised group riding? Is cyclechat basically a glorified facebook group, putting like minded people in contact for discussion of the hobby and informal rides?

Well, define "club", define "organized group riding".
Here in Glasgow there are several groups, some offer led rides but don't class themselves a club, some are clubs with kit and everything, but don't offer led rides, you go at your own risk.
All the clubs and groups I know use FB, a few also use Meetup.com
A forum differs from facebook because you can have a discussion in real time, with facebook you need another app for the discussion to really work, an app like messenger or what's up.
Another difference is the focus on the topic: on FB you inevitably get stuff you don't want to read about, here you can ignore it pretty efficiently, spam is taken care by us mods
So I would say: for knowing about all cycling related stuff, CC is miles ahead of FB.

 

[Smokin Joe]

I think maybe different types of people are members of forums to those who join clubs, though there is of course some crossover. The magazine with the biggest club rider readership is almost certainly Cycling Weekly, yet their forum has never attracted many members despite the mag pushing it and has been dying on it's arse for nearly a decade with hardly any posts at all. In fact when I last looked a week ago it appears to have been pulled completely.

 

[smutchin]

How many actively visiting and recent joiners of CC? A total number of members is pointless if most of them signed up years ago and have not been seen or heard from since? In fact, won't the forum management have to start deleting the details of dormant members now, under GDPR (not that i pretend to understand the implications of GDPR and its implementation).

Right. So the number of active members is considerably less than the 41,455 total. And in fact, the vast majority of posts are probably made by no more than a few hundred members.

BC has over 125,000 members.

I guess BC membership is annual so they know exactly how many members they have at any point, and as they are also selling you a service almost on a commercial basis it isnt really comparable.

To turn your original question on its head, what does CC have to offer BC that it needs or doesn't already have?

 

[Smokin Joe]

To turn your original question on its head, what does CC have to offer BC that it needs or doesn't already have?

A sense of humour.

 

[smutchin]

Well, define "club", define "organized group riding".
Here in Glasgow there are several groups, some offer led rides but don't class themselves a club, some are clubs with kit and everything, but don't offer led rides, you go at your own risk.

Indeed. BC has around 2,200 affiliated clubs but there are many clubs and groups that are not affiliated to BC - or the CTC/Cycling UK, for that matter. I can think of a few locally.

Elsewhere, ACME, AC Hackney and AC Bristol are clubs with a sizeable active membership that organise rides and social events and have their own kit, and AFAIK are not affiliated to BC (perhaps because they are not involved in racing or organising sportives, which are the only sensible reasons for a club to affiliate itself to BC).

 

[Bollo]

That's interesting. Locally to me, Breeze rides are only bookable through the Let's Ride website, which I have to say is quite appalling. When a ride is "full" it disappears from the site, which means the "champion" who is leading the ride has to be contacted by other means so that one can be put on an invisible "waiting list" in the hope that someone else drops out - due to some apparent rule about the number of people a "champion" can be responsible for (eight). Too many people want to go, and another "champion" has to be drafted in. It is all unnecessarily bureaucratic, irritating, and eventually tends to become not worth the effort for most people, just to go for a social ride. One good side effect of this is that new riders persist in their enthusiasm for it, and so Breeze does actually get more women back on their bikes, just by a very roundabout route.

Ironically I was supposed to be at a volunteers meeting this evening, but the area rep had to cancel due to illness.

From the other side of the fence I agree completely. Easy bit first - the website is [tempted to use forum-foo to bypass swear filter] crap and only gets worse when you have to use it to organise a ride!

The website masks some more serious issues though. BC just isn't agile enough and too fond of process and hierarchy to build lasting communities of cyclists in the way that CC/FNRttC et al manages. Local successes often depend on relationships outside the formal BC channels, which may explain why Breeze is relatively successful here. Unfortunately BC seem unwilling to either break out of their top-down control-freakery or recognise that their ride initiatives could be used as a gateway to other less formal but more grassroots rides.

The 1:8 ratio is an insurance thing, although personally I like having at least two leaders on a ride no matter what the body count. I makes life a lot easier!

 

[smutchin]

Unfortunately BC seem unwilling to either break out of their top-down control-freakery or recognise that their ride initiatives could be used as a gateway to other less formal but more grassroots rides.

Isn't that effectively delegated out to clubs? - in much the same way that the CTC delegates out responsibility for organising rides at a local level to semi-autonomous DAs (or used to - I don't know how it works under the Cycling UK regime).

My club arranges plenty of group rides, formal and informal, including some women-only rides.

 

[palinurus]

other forums came and went (notably another cycling forum)

They didn't really went- they had a (mini) mass exodus also (following the 2008 smiley wars) to an alternative site hosted by a couple of the members. 5000-ish members and I still post there when I want DIY advice or when I've seen an interesting or unusual boat. Also to post pictures of my cat.

 

[Bollo]

Isn't that effectively delegated out to clubs? - in much the same way that the CTC delegates out responsibility for organising rides at a local level to semi-autonomous DAs (or used to - I don't know how it works under the Cycling UK regime).

My club arranges plenty of group rides, formal and informal, including some women-only rides.

For BC, I’m talking specifically about their LetsRide and Breeze schemes. These are really aimed at getting people back into cycling, rather than the more committed cyclists that your average affiliated road club will attract. Very very crudely, they’re the cycling equivalent of couch to 5k.

But in some ways you’ve made my point. For most people, joining a BC Guided or Breeze Ride will almost certainly be their first contact with a cycling organisation. As volunteers we should be encouraged to point people in the direction of clubs, forums etc, but it’s just not on the radar. I do it informally, but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s not ‘policy’.

To give an example of how unwieldy it can get, up until this year, volunteers could only lead rides on designated routes determined and risk assessed in advance and usually only in areas where BC had done a funding deal with the local authority. In my area, this meant rides in Southampton, which would put me off cycling for good. To BCs credit, they’ve recognised this is rubbish and loosened the reigns. It’s now possible to design a route yourself and become its “champion” (as for @User13710 ‘s experience). I’m going to attempt to do this later this year, but there are still many hoops to jump and it may even involve another course to make sure I don’t plan a route along the M3 or through a minefield or something.

 

[Shut Up Legs]

this place started out in 2005 and was inhabited by a few sheep and a unicycling cat.

the popular cycling plus forum morphed into bike radar, which resulted in the mass exodus of disgruntled punters in 2007 who found this place and and had enough of a critical mass to make it their own.

other forums came and went (notably another cycling forum), and this forum has grown with the increase in interest in cycling that extends beyond the pre-2012 cycling subculture.

most social media was in its infancy in 2007, so the fact that the forum is not only surviving but thriving is testament to site owner, moderators and, more importantly, users, who keep the good ship running in good order…