Incentivising cycling at work

[Andy in Germany]

Trouble is every body in Nottingham dumped their cars on side streets and did the last bit of the trip by bus, it was a nightmare at our daughters student let, and all the streets round there, a really well thought out plan, not.

This is a symptom, not a cause. The cause is still too many motor vehicles and a cultural idea that car users can store their property for free on a public space for some reason. it just moved so you need to deal with it there instead of rejecting the basic idea.

Looks like the solution is fairly simple:

Local streets here are "Residents Only" 10am-4pm Monday to Friday. No restrictions at other times.

A very effective way of keeping out commuters but allowing free movement of Locals

 

[DRM]

This is a symptom, not a cause. The cause is still too many motor vehicles and a cultural idea that car users can store their property for free on a public space for some reason. it just moved so you need to deal with it there instead of rejecting the basic idea.

Looks like the solution is fairly simple:

That’s correct, but being an ill conceived plan, the council created more of a problem for other residential areas, than they cured in the name of improving the environment for everyone, I think that now public transport should be taken back under local authority control, get inexpensive fares on regular routes to where people work, at the times they need to be at work, it’s got to be worth a go, let commuters leave their cars at home, not someone else’s home

 

[DRM]

The law of unintended consequences in action!

Exactly, I reckon they were more interested in raising revenue, than protecting the environment

 

[Gillstay]

Exactly, I reckon they were more interested in raising revenue, than protecting the environment

Doesn't that kind of comment rather undermine what they were trying to do and needs to be done.

 

[DRM]

Doesn't that kind of comment rather undermine what they were trying to do and needs to be done.

No, because the whole plan was a shambles, the idea undermined itself without any help from me

 

[Big T]

The revenue raised from the Nottingham Parking Levy was and is used to build and extend the Nottingham Tram Network. So Yes the idea was to raise revenue, but the revenue was then spent on improving public transport.

The only problem with that is that the Tram network still only runs to certain areas of the city. It’s great if you live in Bulwell, Beeston, Basford, Clifton or Wilford. Not so great if you live in Bridgford, Arnold, Carlton.

 

[DRM]

The revenue raised from the Nottingham Parking Levy was and is used to build and extend the Nottingham Tram Network. So Yes the idea was to raise revenue, but the revenue was then spent on improving public transport.

The only problem with that is that the Tram network still only runs to certain areas of the city. It’s great if you live in Bulwell, Beeston, Basford, Clifton or Wilford. Not so great if you live in Bridgford, Arnold, Carlton.

Exactly, my daughter was in digs in West Bridgford, it became a dumping ground for commuters cars, blocking streets, and even driveways, surely it’s better to get people who live well out of the city centre onto cheap buses, in order to get them into work, this was not what they envisaged when they came up with the scheme, mind you at least Nottingham has the tram system and it seems regular buses from all directions, unlike Leeds who have wasted more money on cockeyed schemes that never see the light of day, yet have cost the city millions

 

[Big T]

Yes, Nottingham has a pretty good bus network, even as far out as Bingham, where I live. It’s problems with traffic are partially caused by not having a Ring Road on the east side of the city, forcing traffic into the city centre to cross one of the bridges over the Trent.

 

[Andy in Germany]

Most of the above problems seem to be not regulating cars: if you allow car users a free for all in a city the centre soon becomes unlivable in the ways described, amongst others.


Conversely, taking space from cars and giving it to other forms of transport automatically improves quality of life for people. In the example above, others have already pointed out that making a residential area a "residents only" zone during work hours reduces congestion and parking issues.

Yes, Nottingham has a pretty good bus network, even as far out as Bingham, where I live. It’s problems with traffic are partially caused by not having a Ring Road on the east side of the city, forcing traffic into the city centre to cross one of the bridges over the Trent.

You aren't really forcing traffic; no-one is forced to drove in a city. Closing the city to through traffic would reduce the problem, and encourage people to use alternatives across the urban area. Experience from cities around the world shows that the traffic flows adjust to the space available, and people use the easiest form of transport.

Of course this would also mean massively increasing the tram, bus and bike lanes across the city, and preferably regional trains as well.

 

[Big T]

Yes, but the problem is the River Trent. It can only be crossed via the 2 bridges in the city centre or the next bridge which is 10 miles to the east. What is needed is another bridge in between these. At the moment, the traffic must drive all the way into the centre to cross one of the bridges, then out again onto the southern link road that joins with the rest of the Ring Road.

 

[Andy in Germany]

Yes, but the problem is the River Trent. It can only be crossed via the 2 bridges in the city centre or the next bridge which is 10 miles to the east. What is needed is another bridge in between these. At the moment, the traffic must drive all the way into the centre to cross one of the bridges, then out again onto the southern link road that joins with the rest of the Ring Road.

The problem is the volume of cars entering the city. If the city stopped all through traffic those bridges would no longer be congested. and other forms of transport, like bicycles would be more attractive.

It may sound counter intuitive, but this won't cause chaos. Induced Demand is a phenomenon that has been observed for several decades now; when a road route is closed, there is short term congestion but then road users find alternatives. Of course this means you have to provide alternatives, but cities have found the chaos predicted by the car lobby failed to materialise.

Conversely, building another bridge / road, which has been the solution in Europe and N. America for nearly a century now, just causes even more congestion within a surprisingly short period of time.

 

[CXRAndy]

Where does the partially disabled Muslim fit in?
Or the female employee nervous about lone cycling in the dark in the winter?
#IndirectDiscrimination

Encouragement by facilities is legally fine.
Bribing or punishing is not.

Public transport 👍

 

[CXRAndy]

First deal with the majority to have a modal shift in use from car



"Logic clearly dictates that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few."

👍

 

[Andy in Germany]

Where does the partially disabled Muslim fit in?
Or the female employee nervous about lone cycling in the dark in the winter?
#IndirectDiscrimination

Encouragement by facilities is legally fine.
Bribing or punishing is not.

A partially disabled person would clearly be exempt; in most countries that's a given.

A nervous female employee would probably benefit from looking at the actual numbers and likelihood of being attacked, which would have the side benefit of helping them live a more free and full life in other areas as well as commuting; men are the most likely targets of violent crime.

Naturally, this only applies to people with the wealth to afford a car; less wealthy people have always had to deal with this fear, and traffic, and poor infrastructure, which is surely a form of discrimination in itself.

 

[Andy in Germany]

First deal with the majority to have a modal shift in use from car



"Logic clearly dictates that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few."

👍

Ironically it's currently few that get infrastructure built for them, which the many then subsidise.