Moped gangs.

[NickNick]

We also have a police policy that says the police cant pursue if they dont have a helmet!!

So they throw that away and police stop chasing them. Would it really matter if the fell off? I wont get upset if they get hurt or better still die.

We do still have police cars dont we??

That's a bit ridiculous, you're effectively claiming that a policy of extra judicial death penalty is acceptable for what are in the grand scheme of things, compared to murder, sexual offences... not the most serious of offences. I'd rather live in a more civilised society even if it does mean it takes longer to catch some criminals.

 

[Drago]

If a criminal kills himself on a stolen motorbike while unlafully riding it in order to unlafully evade the authorities, how on Earth is that an extra judicial death sentence? In such a scenario their death comes about entirely as a result of their own actions, choices of behaviour that they willingly made themselves.

Why should a police officer face trial for death by dangerous driving, because a thief on a stolen moped with no licence or insurance falls off and kills themselves, "kills themselves" being the important words here?

How can that morally be the fault of any other person? If I fall off my own motorbike its nobody's fault but mine, so why should a criminal enjoy additional protection under the judicial system?

I don't condone the police needlessly slapping people about one little bit, or taking them down alleys and quietly slotting them, not one iota - conversely, criminals are responsible for their own actions and I couldn't care less if they come a cropper, just so long as they don't hurt any innocent people.

Its not extrajudicual punishment - its natural selection.

 

[Paulus]

There is a famous case that happened in London sometime back where a moped rider, who was known and was wanted for questioning, was pursued by police and then he crashed and was killed. The family have had a big campaign going with supposedly the local community for the police and the officers to be charged with his death. The Police can't win.

 

[Piemaster]

Stingers can't be used against them either, in case they come to harm!

Not 100% sure but think stingers are regarded as lethal force against 2 (and 3) wheel vehicles. Think how uncontrollable a bike is after a puncture, let alone the possibility of a sportsbike flat out.
Seem to recall Police being made mockery of when they couldn't stop a Reliant on a motorway - the above was reason why.

 

[classic33]

That is very true. They almost never pursue two wheelers because of the risk to the rider. Sounds dumb, I mean, who cares if a thief hurts themselves, but the officers potentially face prosecution for manslaughter if Johnny Scumbag falls off and karks it.

"Scrambler" bikes won't be authorised to pursue either - I know, I used to ride them, and the quads.

West Yorkshire Police have eight. Initial training done with GMP.

 

[Mugshot]

PC&A thread!!!!

Oh..........

 

[classic33]

PC&A thread!!!!

Oh..........

Stinger deployed.

 

[Levo-Lon]

That's a bit ridiculous, you're effectively claiming that a policy of extra judicial death penalty is acceptable for what are in the grand scheme of things, compared to murder, sexual offences... not the most serious of offences. I'd rather live in a more civilised society even if it does mean it takes longer to catch some criminals.

Am I?

As has been said old bill can' chase..
But your right I don' care if they die.

Liberal softly approach is why we have this problem..go figure

 

[Chris S]

 

[jefmcg]

Am I?

As has been said old bill can' chase..
But your right I don' care if they die.

Liberal softly approach is why we have this problem..go figure

Yup, that's working out so well in Brazil

 

[NickNick]

Am I?

As has been said old bill can' chase..
But your right I don' care if they die.

Liberal softly approach is why we have this problem..go figure

Yes you are:

... or better still die.

The "liberal softly approach" is not why we have this problem. There have always been problems with gangs of badly behaved law breaking young men (including ones on mopeds & bikes), just look at what the rockers & mods used to get up to in brighton in the 1960s, which was hardly an era where we had a liberal softly softly approach to crime and law enforcement:

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/mods-v-rockers-1964-beach-3437302

Glasgow has had problems with gangs of young men all the way back to the 1870s with the Penny Mobs (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Penny_Mobs)

America hardly has a softly softly approach to crime what with their death penalty, draconian mandatory minimum sentences & discriminatory bail bond system. Has it stopped violent crime and young men behaving badly? No

Iran executes drug dealers, imprisons drug users for very long sentences, have no liberal harm reduction policies in place. Has their drug problem gone away? No, they have one of the highest rates of heroin addiction in the world.

Also the idea that we have a soft approach to the criminal justice system is just plain wrong, we doubled the prison population through the late 90s/early00s for very little benefit and the broken windows theory is very much discredited.

Funnily enough, the countries that have taken a more "liberal" (evidence based is what it really is) approach to their criminal justice system seem to have much lower levels of crime and social disorder.

 

[Rickshaw Phil]

Mod note:

The conversation has become one for the shiny new politics forum if you want to debate crime and punishment. Locking this now.