Proposed badger cull

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I have grave reservations about this. First of all, I don't think the scientific case for a cull is made out. Secondly, the present proposal is to allow free shooting of badgers. Badgers are big strong animals, and few farmers will have a rifle (basically a deer rifle) of sufficient power to kill the badger humanely. I foresee a lot of badly wounded badgers in the future. What do others think?
 
From what I can gather the cull if all goes well well will only reduce Bovine TB by 30-40% in the affected areas and will drive badgers into adjacent ares so spreading the infection.
 

theclaud

Openly Marxist
Location
Swansea
Shouldn't this be in The Pub? :whistle:

I'm getting mixed up - I thought the Welsh badger cull was still on hold? If there's news can we have a linky, please?
 
OP
OP
Cycling Naturalist
Location
Llangollen
Shouldn't this be in The Pub? :whistle:

I'm getting mixed up - I thought the Welsh badger cull was still on hold? If there's news can we have a linky, please?


I dunno - the discussions in the pub seemed to be about beer, whereas in cafe, pest controllers were being described as perverted sickos. It's all very confusing.


I suspect the Welsh badger cull is only on hold until enough traps with big spiked jaws can be made.
 
The Krebbs report after the initial run of badger culling showed that culling badgers in one area actually increased the amount of bovine TB because new, TB infested badgers came into the area due to the new availability of habitat once the original ones had been culled. Tbh I'm not sure why the government ever approved this round of culling, other than to bow to the considerable pressure from the farming industry to do something about the bovine TB levels in this country. TB is a massive source of economic loss for Britain's farmers and something definitely needs to be done, I don't think the current plan is the answer though.
 

Yellow Fang

Legendary Member
Location
Reading
Why can't cattle be vaccinated? I was vaccinated against TB as 14-year-old, much against my will. I remember the horror stories about the size of the needles and the big lump that came up. Even the word vaccine is derived from the Latin for cow. Edward Jenner infected a boy with cow pox before infecting him with small pox to see if he'd die or not.
 
Why can't cattle be vaccinated? I was vaccinated against TB as 14-year-old, much against my will. I remember the horror stories about the size of the needles and the big lump that came up. Even the word vaccine is derived from the Latin for cow. Edward Jenner infected a boy with cow pox before infecting him with small pox to see if he'd die or not.


Because there is currently no way to distinguish a vaccinated cow from an infected one, they would both react strongly to the current TB test that is available.
 
I'm sure I was once told that badgers don't spread bovine TB...

also aren't they protected?


They do, but they are not the only wildlife responsible. They are protected from being killed by Joe Public but not from government authorised culling sessions.
 

Amheirchion

Active Member
Location
Northampton
From memory, it hasn't been proven that badgers are the cause of the tB. Some theories hold that the badgers do transmit it, but that they pick it up from other cows first.

As for culling, all that does is, as already noted, increase the movement of the badgers, thus increasing the likelihood of badger/bovine interaction. Where culling does work is in areas where the badgers cannot move into the recently culled areas. A study was done in Ireland on cattle farms that were bordered on several sides by impassable terrain (busy roads, rivers, cliffs), on any other sides a further area was culled and monitored to create an artificial barrier. On these farms cases of bovine tB were reduced.
This won't work in the UK though, as we have few places that match the isolation required.

They are protected by law, but licences can be granted to cull or move them where all other options have been tried and failed.
 

Yellow Fang

Legendary Member
Location
Reading
Because there is currently no way to distinguish a vaccinated cow from an infected one, they would both react strongly to the current TB test that is available.

Can't a cow be marked by the vet somehow when it's vaccinated? Aren't calves routinely innoculated against a bunch of diseases? I don't know.
 
Can't a cow be marked by the vet somehow when it's vaccinated? Aren't calves routinely innoculated against a bunch of diseases? I don't know.


Some diseases yes. Some sort of marking would be a good idea, but it would have to be something that cannot be mimicked by lay people. A lot of research is being done at the moment to tag the vaccine strain of virus so that vaccinated vs infected can be distinguished by a blood test or similar, but there is nothing available yet unfortunately.
 

subaqua

What’s the point
Location
Leytonstone
I have grave reservations about this. First of all, I don't think the scientific case for a cull is made out. Secondly, the present proposal is to allow free shooting of badgers. Badgers are big strong animals, and few farmers will have a rifle (basically a deer rifle) of sufficient power to kill the badger humanely. I foresee a lot of badly wounded badgers in the future. What do others think?




most farmers have shotguns though and i can't see a badger surviving a shotgun blast.
 

Yellow Fang

Legendary Member
Location
Reading
Some diseases yes. Some sort of marking would be a good idea, but it would have to be something that cannot be mimicked by lay people. A lot of research is being done at the moment to tag the vaccine strain of virus so that vaccinated vs infected can be distinguished by a blood test or similar, but there is nothing available yet unfortunately.

It gets worse. You mean badgers are to be culled because of the dishonesty of certain farmers or cattle traders.
 
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