Prove Its Yours

[Brandane]

I could direct them here to the "new bike" thread!

Seriously though, I (and most) probably won't need to prove it's your bike to stop it being seized. I'm aware of the thread that spawned this.

The power of the police to seize suspected stolen property is within Section 19 of the Police and Criminal Evidence Act, to prevent it being disposed of, sold, etc.

The option exists for us to allow the current holder to keep it, with a legal requirement that they cannot sell it, dispose of it, give it away etc. They can be given a formal notice under Section 66 of PACE. In the referenced thread, this would have been my preferred option.

This only falls down when you don't carry any ID so that we can confirm who you are and where you live. In that scenario, we can't in good faith let you take away something we believe is stolen, giving you the benefit of the doubt with no recourse to find you again should you not deserve it.

My solution would therefore be not to overly worry about proving ownership of the bike, but carry ID to prove who you are and where you live (most of us do anyway) and hopefully the sensible course of action will take place.

Unless you happen to have a criminal record for theft / handling in which case... Sorry.

"Terribly sorry Officer, but since you gave me that notice under section 66 of PACE, some rotten nobber has gone and stolen the bike from me. I know it's hard to believe Officer, but that's what happened so you will never see the bike again. Terrible place this Officer, but you know how it is!"

 

[CopperCyclist]

"Terribly sorry Officer, but since you gave me that notice under section 66 of PACE, some rotten nobber has gone and stolen the bike from me. I know it's hard to believe Officer, but that's what happened so you will never see the bike again. Terrible place this Officer, but you know how it is!"

 

[Brandane]

View attachment 101468

Sums it up perfectly!
Methinks your section 60 of PACE legislation (and others) were dreamt up by some social worker type with a lot more faith in human nature than I have. They didn't really give much thought to thieving scrotes having a bit of savvy .

 

[classic33]

What's the context and who is asking for this proof? I don't know what the other thread is so a link would be good.

My view, no matter who is doing the asking, is to say I don't need to prove it's mine, unless the questioner is a cop who can first tell me his reasonable grounds for suspecting it's stolen.

GC

I didn't include a link because I placed the situation in which you were asked, in the opening post.

That being that whilst on a ride you were asked to prove the bike was yours.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

Holy moly! I just had a brainwave. The next time I remove the bottom bracket on my road or touring bike, I'll tape a sealed plastic bag to the outside of the plastic cylinder that fits between the 2 bottom bracket cartridges, said bag containing various personal details. Yes, I know, it's not easy to get at, but that's kind of the point, isn't it? No thief, or prospective thief, would think to look there.

Until now!

GC

 

[TissoT]

A little off the topic : You could say this about most items ..
A lawn mower goes missing out of next doors shed
I have a identical one (which in case this is true)
he could ask to see some ID where I got it from and if I haven't

 

[Illaveago]

Except that in this case you had 2 witnesses backing up one persons claim to the property, supported by an allegation that the bike had a unique identifying feature (the bent bars).
This thread is slightly worrying in that it seems some posters are wishing to have the Police's hands tied behind their backs even more than they already are. Consider the scenario where you have had a bike stolen, and some months later you see someone on a bike which you are convinced (rightly or wrongly) is yours, because it has a similar identifiable feature on it. You grab the bike and alert the Police. Officer turns up and says there is nothing he can do because you do not have sufficient proof there and then that the bike is yours. He lets the rider go with the bike, and 10 minutes later it is at the bottom of a canal.
I would be seething with the Police.

Thank you, I was thinking along similar lines.

 

[mjr]

Well the scrambled egg wearers or someone didn't do their job properly: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-30686697.

So anything registered on immobilise before this January should now be regarded as published.

The police don't have a great track record on IT security. Many forces didn't accept reports of e-crimes when I last checked, often saying it's a civil matter between the harmed company and the attacker, which hasn't been true for at least 25 years. If your approach to most IT crimes is la-la-la-I'm-not-listening, you've not much experience to be able to verify someone else's security practices.

 

[Gravity Aided]

I normally try to have an address label on the seat post, and within the bottom bracket as well. Saw it work for a friend of my dad's in similar situation

 

[kiriyama]

A little off the topic : You could say this about most items ..
A lawn mower goes missing out of next doors shed
I have a identical one (which in case this is true)
he could ask to see some ID where I got it from and if I haven't

reminds me of an incident that happened in my father inlaws village in Lincolnshire. .... 27 lawnmowers went missing from the surrounding villages and a van stopped that was being driven by a notorious local thief from a local notorious family happened to have 27 lawnmowers in the back.... no one could legaly prove that they were the same lawnmowers.... notorious thief was proved innocent and given 'his' lawnmowers back....

Guess no one takes time stamped pictures of their lawnmowers!

P.s. I was told this story so no idea how much of it is nonsense!

 

[Illaveago]

It can be difficult trying to prove ownership of an older bike which you were either given or bought second hand as you probably wouldn't have any form of
Receipt.
The old method was to stamp your post code into the bottom bracket, which I suppose would be harder to disguise if it was in your possession for a number of years. I know that this wouldn't work on composite frames or if the bike had a long list of previous owners.
I suppose you are
left in fear of going out and somebody mistakenly identifying your bike as theirs.

 

[Tin Pot]

Rather than hijack the other thread, I'll ask the question here.
If you were out on a ride and asked to prove that the bike you were riding was legally yours, how would you go about it.

This is more about being able to prove, at the time, that it was yours.

I live in a free society, I neither have to prove who I am nor what I own in my day to day business.

That would be, and has been, my response to police and those who see themselves in positions of authority.

 

[summerdays]

I've just been taking additional photos of what I consider to be unique bits of my bike and adding it to my Facebook album, plus whilst searching for something else I stumbled upon the original post I made when I bought it, so I've taken a screen shot of that to add to the album too. So I would be able to provide a history and visual evidence. I think I may be taking it a bit too far.....

 

[Hitchington]

 

[Spinney]

It can be difficult trying to prove ownership of an older bike which you were either given or bought second hand as you probably wouldn't have any form of
Receipt.
The old method was to stamp your post code into the bottom bracket, which I suppose would be harder to disguise if it was in your possession for a number of years. I know that this wouldn't work on composite frames or if the bike had a long list of previous owners.
I suppose you are
left in fear of going out and somebody mistakenly identifying your bike as theirs.

But in that case the 'outraged victim of theft' wouldn't be able to prove it was theirs either?