Reflective Paint

[spindrift]

**** me.

 

[magnatom]

**** me.

It was shocking driving wasn't it. But I think we can safely say that the cyclist was nice and visible. The cyclist didn't help though with his poor road position.

What are you trying to say here spindrift (apart from testing the swearing filter )

 

[spindrift]

I was trying to say with economy of speech that the driver deserves a kicking. The cyclist seemed to treat the incident with an equanimity I would be unable to match.

 

[LLB]

I'm not guilty of risk compensation. Can you prove that I am?

How can you say this conversation is a wasted effort? Visibility is a priority in cycling and is right up there with road position and cyclecraft. As others have pointed out we are vulnerable, we don't have a cage around us, so we need all the help we can get to avoid collisions. Visibility plays a part in that. So discussions like this are very relevant.

Part of my job is running functional MRI research, where we want to answer questions about how the brain functions. A lot of this work is clinically based, however, I do work with psychologists as well. I am tempted to chat with some of the visual perception psychologists to see if they would be interested in doing a project in hazard perception in peripheral vision of cyclists with and without hi-viz jackets. If I had the time that is.

My feeling would be that on a conscience level where a driver can tell you he has seen a cyclist there would be little or no difference in brain activation, and in the way the driver would react. However, where a cyclist appears in the peripheral vision and the driver couldn't tell you if they had seen a cyclist or not. I would hypothesis that recognition areas would be active more where the cyclist was wearing yellow compared to grey/black.

Now it might be suggested that detecting something unconsciously would not affect a drivers actions. However, from what I know of psychology (not a huge amount) this is not the case. It might spur the driver to hesitate, or to look again. Any psychologists on here?

Anyway thats the science out of the way.

If you want to be seen (better) wear bright colours (i.e. yellow) not grey!

High viz under sodium lighting has no better impact than white clothing and reflective clothing appears dark unless lit which makes it mostly inefficient.

With a drivers hat on, I can understand why the smidsy happens even with high vis on the cyclist.

 

[LLB]

**** me.

The driver saw the cyclist, but he either underestimated their progress, or was just chancing it and treated them with contempt.

A shocking piece of driving which deserves at the very least an 'undue care and attention' conviction with a decent sized fine IMO

 

[Maz]

I was trying to say with economy of speech that the driver deserves a kicking. The cyclist seemed to treat the incident with an equanimity I would be unable to match.

Equanimity - good word, that. Thanks.
Can't see the vid from work - I'll watch it later.

 

[magnatom]

High viz under sodium lighting has no better impact than white clothing and reflective clothing appears dark unless lit which makes it mostly inefficient.

With a drivers hat on, I can understand why the smidsy happens even with high vis on the cyclist.

This may be true (although I'm not sure that is the case), but under white lighting the hi-viz becomes more visible than just white. So why not wear something that is as good as or often is better than just plain white.

Also I am sure you agree that under sodium lighting white or hi-viz would be more visible than grey/black/dark blue.

I can also understand why SMIDSYs happen. Drivers just don't look for us, they don't expect us, they just misjudge our speed etc.

Wearing hi-viz will not guarantee you will be seen, but it will help. That's all I am saying.

 

[magnatom]

I was trying to say with economy of speech that the driver deserves a kicking. The cyclist seemed to treat the incident with an equanimity I would be unable to match.

Ah, I thought you were just stirring .

I think the cyclist was completely oblivious to what had happened. That's partly why I had to double take!

Road position, cyclecraft and visibility. Surely they are all equally important.

 

[Tynan]

High viz under sodium lighting has no better impact than white clothing and reflective clothing appears dark unless lit which makes it mostly inefficient.

With a drivers hat on, I can understand why the smidsy happens even with high vis on the cyclist.

I can't accept that at all

under sodium lighting alone, perhaps to a point, but in urban traffic there's plenty of light around, and particularly from the vehicle driving towards a cyclist

there's no excuse for smidsy, it happens because people don't look for cyclists/motorbikes/anything

by all means make an argument but discounting it is nonsense, worse case it makes no difference, in all other cases it makes a difference to some degree, it can;t make things worse, please don't trot out the over confidence argument

 

[LLB]

I can't accept that at all

under sodium lighting alone, perhaps to a point, but in urban traffic there's plenty of light around, and particularly from the vehicle driving towards a cyclist

there's no excuse for smidsy, it happens because people don't look for cyclists/motorbikes/anything

by all means make an argument but discounting it is nonsense, worse case it makes no difference, in all other cases it makes a difference to some degree, it can;t make things worse, please don't trot out the over confidence argument

I also ride a motorcycle (600 supersports, was out on it yesterday) so I am well aware of my mortality regarding these bikes also.
I'm not mitigating the fact that (some) people in cars don't look for smaller vehicles, just to try and offer a better understanding of the reasons why.

 

[Tynan]

I don't mind the discussion, I get irritated by people suggesting and even asserting that Hi Viz is useless, ditto helmets

not saying you did either

 

[Arch]

Col, you may think you're not guilty of risk compensation, but you are. Simply cycling and wearing your hiviz makes you a risk compensator.

And now you know every single one of us to be able to say this sort of thing? Rubbish. I wear hi-vis, but I'm also one of the most cautious people I know. I ride in a suitable road position, I don't make a move until I am very sure I can do so safely, I frequently check over my shoulder, use my hearing, carry lights (more than one of each type), I never assume that someone has seen me, and I always try to ride in a way that allows me to stop in an emergency. I sound very boring, I know, but I really don't believe that wearing a yellow coat affects my riding style adversely in any way.

If someone isn't going to look, then I could be wearing one of the Jodrell bank telescopes painted yellow on my head and they wouldn't see me. But if all they are going to do is give me a quick glance, I really do think I am more likely to catch their eye in light coat, with reflectives etc...

 

[magnatom]

If someone isn't going to look, then I could be wearing one of the Jodrell bank telescopes painted yellow on my head and they wouldn't see me. But if all they are going to do is give me a quick glance, I really do think I am more likely to catch their eye in light coat, with reflectives etc...

If you were wearing one of those telescopes on your head, all you would have to do is lower your head and you would take out all of the traffic on the road. So I put it to you, that you would indeed be very safe wearing a Jodrell Bank telescope!

 

[Arch]

If you were wearing one of those telescopes on your head, all you would have to do is lower your head and you would take out all of the traffic on the road. So I put it to you, that you would indeed be very safe wearing a Jodrell Bank telescope!

Might have a sore neck though....

 

[magnatom]

Might have a sore neck though....

Your probably right. It probably wouldn't fit too well down the narrow street of York either.....