Retarded development

[magnatom]

This is not what the debate is about; I am asking you why you think it's OK for you to insult people and not OK for Catrike to do it.

Stop trying to divert debate and stick to the original topic.

I think it is you trying to change the topic! I have no problems with Catrike insulting individuals, but I do have problems with the use of the term ret@rd. That is what started all of this. It had nothing to do with the fact that he was insulting the individual, but the term used to do it.

You have agreed that you would use one term and not the other, which makes my point quite nicely. Double standards when it comes to mental illness. I am not suggesting that this is Catrike's problem in particular, but a general problem. I just hope that this discussion might make people think twice about using such terms.

I am not and in the past in particular, have not been perfect. Our local shop where I lived when I was a child was run by some chaps from Pakistan. Very nice they were too, and I worked for them for a while, packing potatoes! However, through my ignorance, among friends I would call the shop the p@kis.

Thinking back to this, makes me cringe. It was particularly insulting, but at the time I just did not realise that, until it was pointed out to me. If I hear someone saying that now I will make a comment about it. I don't just do it online.

It is entirely possible that Catrike and others (possibly yourself) have just not fully appreciated the insulting nature of the term ret@rd in the same way. I just felt it necessary to point this out.

 

[magnatom]

I would read it first if I were you.

It would appear that you just haven't understand the point that I have tried to make, or you have chose to ignore it. I'm sorry that that is the case.

 

[Fnaar]

Tw*t is a reference to a part of a ladies body.

PE lesson I was a pupil in, circa 1979... one player misses a basket in basketball...teammate calls him "twat". Teacher (angry man) say "Does he look like a woman's vagina? Eh?". Offending pupil says: "Don't know sir, I've never seen one". You had to be there, but it was funny!

 

[cisamcgu]

Do you use the words ret@rd or sp@stic?

Why are you using an "@" ? Does it magically make the word less offensive ?

 

[magnatom]

Why are you using an "@" ? Does it magically make the word less offensive ?

It does not, but I don't like typing the word never mind saying it. I suppose it just makes the point that it is an offensive word.

 

[Tetedelacourse]

I never understood why paki (or p@ki) was offensive in its own right (i.e. not in a derogatory context).

 

[Riding in Circles]

It would appear that you just haven't understand the point that I have tried to make, or you have chose to ignore it. I'm sorry that that is the case.

I understand what you are trying to say, but you are ignoring what I and others have said, I have made a joke out of it, why don't you just laugh and move on? Next time I will call them an idiot, ok? You can continue to swear and curse, it makes no never mind to me.

 

[magnatom]

I never understood why paki (or p@ki) was offensive in its own right (i.e. not in a derogatory context).

I must admit, I don't entirely know why either, however, I assume it is related to its use at some point as a derogatory term. Probably in the same way I don't quite understand why some racist terms are particularly offensive. I know they are and I am sure there are good reasons why they are, but I don't know the historical detail.

 

[jely]

One man's bassoon is another man's wizard's sleeve, and the only good Pole is a deed poll, errrr, um.

what i'm finding pure gold is the term wizard sleeve has been written on a cycle forum... never thought i'd see that!!

 

[Tetedelacourse]

Where does the term "mad" come into all this? Does that class as insulting in terms of those with mental illness? I think you know why I'm asking...

 

[jely]

I never understood why paki (or p@ki) was offensive in its own right (i.e. not in a derogatory context).

true - it's like saying Aussie... Kiwi... Saffa... etc, etc...

i think people are just taking political correctness a little too far.

 

[snapper_37]

"wheel" and make a rocking gesture with her hands, we both pulled up at the lights, she tried again, "wh wh wheeeeeeel" (rocking gesture again)

What did she mean by doing this? Was she implying that the trike was a wheelchair?

 

[snapper_37]

true - it's like saying Aussie... Kiwi... Saffa... etc, etc...

i think people are just taking political correctness a little too far.

It may be do to some people continually adding an expletive at the back of paki which didn't help but make the word derogatory. I do find it amusing when 'paki' is used to describe someone from India or Iraq etc.

 

[magnatom]

I understand what you are trying to say, but you are ignoring what I and others have said, I have made a joke out of it, why don't you just laugh and move on? Next time I will call them an idiot, ok? You can continue to swear and curse, it makes no never mind to me.

I honestly don't think I have ignored anything. If I have please let me know what it is. I generally always try and answer all points put to me (I'm not being sarcastic here. I understand that reading that, it might come across that way).

I also realise that you are trying to make light of it. Fair enough, but you haven't conceded the point that I am trying to make which is that my swearing at someone using a term aimed purely at them is different to using terms which describe an unfortunate group of individuals (of course a lot of them don't feel unfortunate!)

I'm not trying to get at you Catrike, I'm sure your a sound bloke, and I certainly appreciate the fact that you won't use the term again, but I just hate the fact that mental illness is generally regarded as the poor cousin of physical illness. Just a sore point with me (work related). It also annoys me slightly that you are taking the piss out of me for trying to highlight one of my principles (people take the piss out of me for many other reasons and that doesn't bother me at all!)

Hey ho. I've said my bit. I have no hard feelings, although I think I may have just lost my cyclechat member discount on the POV.1.....

 

[magnatom]

Where does the term "mad" come into all this? Does that class as insulting in terms of those with mental illness? I think you know why I'm asking...

It's a good point tetdelacourse. I think what matters is what the group themselves think. I know many people who suffer from mental illness who quite openly call themselves mad (usually as a joke). I don't know any that would call themselves ret@rded.

It's about what is acceptable to the group being referenced. I think that is why p@ki is not acceptable because people with a Pakistani origin (or as snapper has pointed out from many other countries!) find the term derogatory.

At least that is my take on it. I'm no expert! Is there anyone from Pakistan on here?