Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
More to the point, does Barclaycard feel lucky?
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You would also be giving away personal info such as delivery and billing address and email address, and a password if you are creating an account, which would be very useful to all sorts of lowlifes.More to the point, does Barclaycard feel lucky?
IanSmithCSE
Guru
- Location
- Worcester, Worcestershire
Good evening,
Bye
Ian
"Old business model" Ribble was heavily based on selling non-retail parts, I received Ultegra parts in a polythene bag with a folded cardboard header, I was quite happy. This was how Airfix sold their cheapest kits, they were obviously not retail packaging and probably annoyed Madison, but they were Shimano parts.
Sorry but nearly all of this is already "publicly" available for quite a low fee, the problem isn't having this information, it is having a card processor who will give you the money before all the customer complaints come in and your account is cancelled and all the payments recalled.
Bye
Ian
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
I use a different, totally unrelated password for everything, and a junk email address for anything that isn't of well known provenance. There are easier ways of finding my address.
Aside from getting my card details they aren't getting useful. The banking act covers me for losses on the card. Theres little risk to me (not that I have any intention of buying from them because im not a fishist).
Aside from getting my card details they aren't getting useful. The banking act covers me for losses on the card. Theres little risk to me (not that I have any intention of buying from them because im not a fishist).
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BurningLegs
Guru
Interesting that they haven’t specifically stated that it’s counterfeit product, just that it’s imitating their brand.
Like others here I wonder if it’s legit gear intended for other markets (embarrassing for Shimano and annoying for their customers) or if it’s “over runs”. I doubt this is happening now due to shortages presumably resulting in a high run rate in factories, but often factories in the Far East will churn out “counterfeit” product that is basically workers doing overtime to create the normal product.
This has been a real problem in my field of IT where leading vendors such as Cisco have had all sort of issues with end users and customers who request support and returns on kit with serial numbers that the vendor doesn’t recognise!
Like others here I wonder if it’s legit gear intended for other markets (embarrassing for Shimano and annoying for their customers) or if it’s “over runs”. I doubt this is happening now due to shortages presumably resulting in a high run rate in factories, but often factories in the Far East will churn out “counterfeit” product that is basically workers doing overtime to create the normal product.
This has been a real problem in my field of IT where leading vendors such as Cisco have had all sort of issues with end users and customers who request support and returns on kit with serial numbers that the vendor doesn’t recognise!
Jenkins
Legendary Member
- Location
- Felixstowe
More than likely has absolutely no stock or any intention of shipping anything and, by ther time the 'buyers' realise they've been had he's long gone having been paid by the credit card company.
I like Skol
A Minging Manc...
- Location
- Sunny Ashton-under-Lyne
Possibly some of THIS^^^^
But also maybe some of THISvvvv
I reckon there must be more than just a few factories sub-contracting to Mr Shimano and I reckon the conversation goes something like this....
"Yes Mr Shimano, we are working 12hrs a day to fulfill your order and the price is very good [but we are actually working around the clock and selling the other 12hrs production on the grey/black market for big profits rather than the peanuts you give us]" ?
Yeah I remember getting Shimano parts from Ribble like that. In one of the packaging, Shimano clearly states " not for individual sale" or something like that . It was meant for intermediaries and bike mechanics for assembly and repairs. I wondered how Madison allowed it. Cheapest parts as I recall. You could mix and match as well.
bonzobanana
Guru
It's always a very confusing situation with regard getting genuine products because there are so many variables. As already pointed out you can have non retail versions of the same product, you can have imports that don't go through the official UK Shimano importer and of course you can have fake products. Shimano themselves use some Chinese factories for their low end products, Tourney etc and some products may be available from that factory without the Shimano branding. Then of course you have the full fake products that look similar but could be destined to fail quite quickly or even break apart. I seem to recall there were sellers that mixed genuine products with fake in the past so different customers would actually get different products when they ordered the same item. I guess this is to get positive reviews.
If you have a retailer who bypasses the official Shimano UK importer and lets say buys from a location in the world where Shimano prices are much more competitive this may actually be the same quality just cheaper. Companies like Poundland, Home Bargains, B&M etc often buy from other markets where products are sold cheaper and import them into the UK themselves. Some products are even made in the UK and re-imported because they are sold cheaper in other markets.
Most actual fake products you can tell when you examine them. A simple picture of the genuine product for comparison normally helps. I seem to remember fake derailleurs missed the shimano branding on the pulley wheels and other minor changes they couldn't be bothered to do.
A while back Amazon were selling a Tourney derailleur for £4.20 and this was Amazon selling it not a marketplace seller. The normal price is back up to about £16 but they sold them at £4.20 for about 4 months it seems. They were genuine Shimano but where did they get this stock to sell at £4.20. I bought quite a few for the parts bin. I'd assume there was an overstock somewhere in the world and they were cleared out cheaply and Amazon bought them, seems unlikely to have come through official channels. I don't think any other retailer had these discounted at the time in the UK. If it wasn't Amazon themselves officially selling them and instead a more dodgy retailer you might assume they were fake.
If you have a retailer who bypasses the official Shimano UK importer and lets say buys from a location in the world where Shimano prices are much more competitive this may actually be the same quality just cheaper. Companies like Poundland, Home Bargains, B&M etc often buy from other markets where products are sold cheaper and import them into the UK themselves. Some products are even made in the UK and re-imported because they are sold cheaper in other markets.
Most actual fake products you can tell when you examine them. A simple picture of the genuine product for comparison normally helps. I seem to remember fake derailleurs missed the shimano branding on the pulley wheels and other minor changes they couldn't be bothered to do.
A while back Amazon were selling a Tourney derailleur for £4.20 and this was Amazon selling it not a marketplace seller. The normal price is back up to about £16 but they sold them at £4.20 for about 4 months it seems. They were genuine Shimano but where did they get this stock to sell at £4.20. I bought quite a few for the parts bin. I'd assume there was an overstock somewhere in the world and they were cleared out cheaply and Amazon bought them, seems unlikely to have come through official channels. I don't think any other retailer had these discounted at the time in the UK. If it wasn't Amazon themselves officially selling them and instead a more dodgy retailer you might assume they were fake.
- Location
- London
Fair to assume that if you bought from amazon or amazon marketplace or ebay and something proved to be fake after delivery/examination that you could get a quick refund?
i do note that some ebay sellers do avoid specifically avoid saying that something IS shimano, but maybe leading you on/getting you to "co-operate" in the fraud so that you have no come-back.
Spoked Wheels
Legendary Member
- Location
- Bournemouth
