Should I have my dog put down?

[Saluki]

Try this lot.

http://www.bordercollietrustgb.org.uk/

I am not sure where you live but the UK branch is a good place to start if you are thinking of rehoming. Do not hand the poor thing over to the RSPCA, they top far too many dogs IMO.

BTW. Ever tried Bike Joring, Collies just love it. It gets them some serious exercise and you just pedal behind, being mostly pulled.

 

[TheDoctor]

Try this lot.

http://www.bordercollietrustgb.org.uk/

I am not sure where you live <snip>

Over in France somewhere.

 

[Cycling Dan]

Your better off asking a vet or a person of expert knowledge in the area not a cycling forum unless someone within fills the quota .
What you do is at the end of the day up to you. However i wouldn't agree with putting the dog down in this instance.

 

[Archie_tect]

Suppose it depends how emotionally attached you get to animals. Had dogs and cats at various times in my life but have always remained somewhat detached- maybe it comes down to coming from farming background. When their time has come, so be it especially if it's aggressive... if it's just a case of hyperactivity then give it to someone who can let it run, but don't give yello such a hard time for not wanting to keep an dog with aggressive behaviour. The original owner set the dog's response patterns not him.

 

[buggi]

Hi, hope i'm not too late.

I had a bearded collie, i got her in about 1999 and she was 7 weeks old. I got her from a farm yard which, i was later informed, was probably a front for a puppy farm. What pursued was 5 weeks of terror at the hands of a puppy. The RSPCA recommended we put her to sleep, but the vet asked us first to go for a session with this guy.

http://www.petbehaviourcentre.com/page4.htm

His name is David Appleby. my dog was vicious with everyone, including us. At first, when the vet said he was a dog psychologist, i thought he was just one of those fad con men. However, an hour in his presence and my then 12 week old dog came out a different dog, and, more importantly, our family was re-educated. The dog whisperer has got nothing on this guy. Not once did he shout any command at my dog, just spoke very calmly and kindly in a soft voice, and what he demonstrated to me changed my mind about how to raise a dog. We only needed one session with him, and one phone call a year later when we had a set back and, although I was always careful when my dog met strangers at the door, i thank God every day that i went to see this guy because i had my dog for 13 wonderful years.

Turns out she had a "fear aggression", basically, she wasn't socialised with humans early enough so she became fearful of them, and that fear turned to aggression. He taught us how to overcome it (in fact, he told me that at 7 weeks we were just in time because if she had not been socialised by 9 weeks it is a very difficult job and by 12 weeks impossible. The set back (which resulted in the phone call a year later) was because she suddenly became aggressive towards my very young nephew. David Appleby said that my nephew may have hurt her in some way, thus the fear had returned. When the family was questioned, turned out my 2 year old nephew had hit her on the head with a massive stone. Again, a bit of instruction from this guy and my dog was calm again with my nephew within a couple of weeks. It was thely set back we had, and totally not the dogs fault.

Strangely enough, the same stuff he taught me also works on untamed ferrets! Get in touch with this guy, he's amazing. If he can't fix your dog, no one will. and besides which,he would tell you straight if your dog had a chance or was beyond help.

 

[buggi]

ps can i just say that if you think your dog has the same problem as mine, and you got your dog after 9 weeks this doesn't mean she wasn't socialised before that, it's the age they first come into proper contact with humans. might not be the same problem anyway so don't write him/her off before speaking to this guy.

 

[snorri]

Dog Rescue Centres are the animal equivalent of the lunatic asylums of old, a dumping ground for those whose behaviour is such that they cannot be allowed to live within normal society for their own safety and/or the safety of others.

 

[TheDoctor]

No, Snorri, that's utterly wrong. Far too simplistic.
Our last dog came from a rescue place.
Her previous owners had been promised a move from a flat to a house.
It didn't happen, so they couldn't keep their puppy.
There's all sorts of reasons why someone can't keep their pet.

 

[lulubel]

It does sound like fear aggression, combined with a lack of exercise and mental stimulation, to me.

Border Collies are highly intelligent dogs and need loads of exercise. We had one when I was a kid, and I used to take her out for walks for 2+ hours every day, and a lot longer on non-school days. She was still a bit neurotic and "snappy" - she bit me once, but it was a fear response to an unusual situation, so no big deal.

I don't know what to suggest. The people saying you shouldn't have taken him on in the first place aren't helping because you can't change that now. If he got a chance to go out running for a few hours a day, he'd probably start to settle down, but that would depend on finding someone who could take him.

 

[The Jogger]

I don't think it paints a bad picture of you at all. You are someone that took on a rescue dog and tried your best. Don't fret about it you have done and are doing the right thing. I adore all animals and have had and have a dog but I think it is admirable what you have done.

 

[Crackle]

Do people read threads anymore? I've read a few responses on this thread and wondered if the responder had even read the op properly, never mind the follow up stuff. It seems like they're in such a breathless rush to get their view in, that it doesn't actually matter what's been said. Well that might be OK in a 'what bike' thread but not on an emotive and sensitive thread like this. Read the thread people, some of you haven't even figured out Yello's in France, despite it being mentioned several times.

 

[Becs]

To add a slightly different take on things, I think it is possible that there could be a medical problem underlying this. The compulsive pacing and unsettled behaviour you describe could be a sign of dementia, especially in an old collie. Also "Collie rage" is a well known phenomenon and once the Collie 'snaps" and has an aggressive episode it is quite likely another will follow. It is believed to be linked to a neurological condition rather than a lack of exercise. I couldn't say that's definitely what happened here without seeing the dog but if you can't trust him not to do it again you do not need to feel guilty about putting him to sleep. 10 is a good age for a collie and the injection is a humane, painless procedure. I would ask your vet for advice on this one (I am a vet, but I don't work in small animal practice and the dog would really need to be examined) but I think it is perfectly reasonable to consider euthanasia in this case.

 

[DRHysted]

Dog Rescue Centres are the animal equivalent of the lunatic asylums of old, a dumping ground for those whose behaviour is such that they cannot be allowed to live within normal society for their own safety and/or the safety of others.

Well thanks for a lovely sweeping statement, makes the effort that my family put into dog rescue worthwhile.
The thing with working sheep dogs is they also need brain exercise. If mishandled they can become uncontrollable very easily, we currently have one in who bite the son (didn't even bruise the skin) and is a terrible shadow chaser, because the family didn't know how to handle her (she'll be fine when she leaves).
Over the years we have failed and had to put some to sleep due to behaviour (the worst tried to get my throat four times), but we have had many sucessess. The key is finding the trigger and working on it.

Reading this thread, it does sound as if the dog is not suitable for it's current placement, but the thing that worries me most is how did the dog bite your face! My advise would be to approach the rescue centre and talk to them.

 

[yello]

Thank you people for your support and suggestions - buggi, lulubel and becs particularly. I think fear aggression is a real possibility. We don't know details of Sam's upbringing but we're lead to believe that he had one owner pretty much his entire life, an elderly gentlemen who then went into a retirement home. So it's possible that he wasn't socialised. Collie rage is a possibility too - Sam is flipping out in response to stressful situations, my fear is he'll become increasingly aggressive.

To those that are critical - off course we could be doing better. You're not saying anything I'm not aware of. As Crackle has pointed out, I have been very upfront about that. We have tried with Sam but have reached the end of our abilities and don't know what else to do. We accept he is beyond us. We made the decision to rehome him before yesterday's events because we saw that we were not the best home for him. It wasn't an easy decision so being critical is not helpful.

The ONLY reason I was considering euthanasia was not because of him beyond us but because of his biting. Yes, it was understandable and in response to a stressful situation but that's not the issue. If he decides to take a lump out of the next person that visits us then there really is trouble. Prior to yesterday,I didn't think that'd happen but now the seed of doubt has been sown. Sam does respond to fear by biting.

BUT I also said (and some seemed to have missed this) we have decided to take him back to the rescue home rather than euthanasia. We'll tell them what happened and leave it in their hands. They are better equipped to make the decision than we are. Clearly, that can be seen as us washing our hands of him (and in a sense we are) but it is also what is better for him. We can't handle him and he's not getting any better. We feel it offers him at least the chance of a better home.

 

[cd365]

I don't think it paints a bad picture of you at all. You are someone that took on a rescue dog and tried your best. Don't fret about it you have done and are doing the right thing. I adore all animals and have had and have a dog but I think it is admirable what you have done.

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