Slammin Sam

[david k]

Not trying to start an argument. That it has more viewers than netball doesn't mean much, here in the south it remains a minority game you only need to look at the repeated failure to make the Broncos a going concern.
And don't get me started on Union viewing figures bf****xy, b*****d BT Sport.
Edit: without looking back over the thread I may have missed a comparison to netball and hockey. If I have I back gracefully away from this argument and leave you and that poster to it

The BBC claim it is a minority sport like netball and hockey, nobody is saying its a majority sport like football or it has followers all over the UK, what we are saying is it has more demand, interest and financial backing than those sports they claim equivalence to. Also not claiming its as big as RU, but looking at several figures and factors it is not the same as those other sports.

The Broncos is a shame, at its best around 10 years ago it was pretty healthy in comparison, several miss management decisions led it to start to fail, i speak online to several broncos fans who are disheartened as it nearly broke into a half decent following. Many Northern fans want to give up on it, many dont have any interest outside of the NW, I do, I would like to see it played all over the UK, Im not interested in having a bigger slice than RU, more than happy for them to co-exist, i hope we get there.

Another thought around the hatred for RL, we (lads school) played a school in North Wales (RU) who said they regularly train RL and the lads love playing it, we played a private school from Cheshire, a parent said they like RL and asked the teacher to try it in games as the lads had asked, he refused to acknowledge it outright saying we are RU and RU only. Our school in the heart of RL territory plays both

 

[PhilDawson8270]

Tomorrows International game is a sell out.

Which isn't common in Rugby League, and not a good argument considering the sales made by the RFU for their internationals.

The super league is regularly in the top 10 of watched sports on Sky each week

Yet most stadiums have space available. Why are people choosing to watch games on TV instead of going to the stadium?

I have witnessed hatred but you are entitled to your opinion.
Years of banning players speaks for itself, RU was asked to be the governing body of RL when it started which was refused.

All very historical, when was the last time a player happened? You're basing your idea that RU fans hate RL on stuff that happened up to 120 years ago. I find most RU fans don't "hate" league, just that they're indifferent. Like I am indifferent to Union or Football.

I only watch Union internationals, I couldn't name you the starting line for England even. But I don't "hate" it, I just prefer League. League fans constantly go on about League abilities with ball in hand, and passing. True, league players are generally much better running and passing than Union players, but lets be honest. The standard of kicking in league is atrocious compared to union, the technical tackling aspects in union are also higher skilled than league. They're 2 different games, with different emphasis on different areas.

As a long term league fan, the only "hatred", I hear is from RL fans about RU.

Plus, the RFL can learn something from the RFU about how to arrange and market the game.

 

[martint235]

I used to go and watch the Broncos at the Valley but then they moved back West. I agree it's a shame.

My wannabe grammar school in Burnley saw RL as working class so we only played RU. I don't count that as hatred though just ignorance of both the game and their students.

 

[PhilDawson8270]

what we are saying is it has more demand, interest and financial backing than those sports they claim equivalence to. Also not claiming its as big as RU, but looking at several figures and factors it is not the same as those other sports.

First, who is we? Next, Cycling has far more financial interest as a sport than Rugby League, and I wouldn't call that a major sport, I'd stick that with minority interest such as Rugby.

In fact, for England, I think outside of Football, most sports are minority, and very localised to the area in which you come from.

I do, I would like to see it played all over the UK,

the sport needs bums on seats to grow, people won't travel 45 miles down a motorway to an away game, what chance is there of a 200 mile trip?

Another thought around the hatred for RL, we (lads school) played a school in North Wales (RU) who said they regularly train RL and the lads love playing it, we played a private school from Cheshire, a parent said they like RL and asked the teacher to try it in games as the lads had asked, he refused to acknowledge it outright saying we are RU and RU only. Our school in the heart of RL territory plays both

Not really relevant. Was the private school in Cheshire, Kings College in Macclesfield? They are massive in Union, my friend went there, and played Union. He also plays league with me now.

My school was big into football, and didn't play Rugby at all, omg that hatred!

 

[Aperitif]

Sorry but it is a minority sport. You can't claim 44,000 to a London game as anything. There are regular higher crowds for NFL and 60,000 today just to see the Indian PM.

I also don't believe there's a lot of hatred: ignorance and ambivalence yes but not hatred.

Now both of those are from a life long Saints fan who now lives in London

That Modi fellah has a wicked sidestep...he's wrong-footed the dozy light blues defence easily.
I was always a fan of RL as a rugbyman / 'rosbif' / Union player - whatever. Totally elite athleticism and toughness. I lived near The Stoop and went to all the London Broncos games...including The Valley, where I could never see because there was some tall git in the cheap seats, blocking my view.
More interesting points have been raised here, above, and we'd be naïve to think that the coaching fraternity had not already thought of that. And also thought to outsmart the refs. It's points. Points mean prizes. Prizes = £€ When we try and relate that to 'our' Corinthian ideals, we might always come up a bit short.

 

[Wafer]

Then forgive me, but your first post here which is an amendment seems to be having a go at League players and supporters.

Yes, pointing out how it's RL fans like you who are doing the pontificating about the better sport. If you read the end of that line it even says "both codes have there good points and bad points"....

Which is the better version of the sport is completely meaningless anyway, let alone irrelevant to the Burgess saga over the last year.

 

[nickyboy]

It's points. Points mean prizes. Prizes = £€ t.

Nail, head. Like all pro sport, it's all about winning. The trouble with RU is that winning often entails not producing a sporting spectacle, rather the opposite. I still maintain that the simplest solution is to change the points structure (6 for a try, 2 for a pen, 2 for a drop goal - and I'm being kind on drop goals there), be much tougher on yellow cards (I like the idea that any pen in the 20 metre zone is automatic yellow). Otherwise you're into finessing the rules again. Or reducing the number of players which will never happen

 

[GrumpyGregry]

More points for a try + less points for a penalty = I'll kill it dead before it gets to the red zone. And my team mates will thank me for it. Because I can give away four kickable penalties for the price of a converted try.

What I would do is introduce another sort of penalty. Free kick => Penalty without option to kick at goal => Penalty with option to kick at goal. The middle sort being for technical offences at the scrum, &c..

 

[martint235]

More points for a try + less points for a penalty = I'll kill it dead before it gets to the red zone. And my team mates will thank me for it. Because I can give away four kickable penalties for the price of a converted try.

What I would do is introduce another sort of penalty. Free kick => Penalty without option to kick at goal => Penalty with option to kick at goal. The middle sort being for technical offences at the scrum, &c..

I've never really understood the current free kick. If you have a feisty scrum or fly half then yes it works otherwise it's just the ball to the opposition. I like penalty with no option to go for the posts.

I'd also do away with (what I think is quite new) kicking out on the full from within your 22, take it back to the kicking line. I'm tempted to say that for all kicks but I haven't really thought through the implications of that yet ie even if it bounces before touch you're back to where you kicked it.

 

[nickyboy]

More points for a try + less points for a penalty = I'll kill it dead before it gets to the red zone. And my team mates will thank me for it. Because I can give away four kickable penalties for the price of a converted try.

What I would do is introduce another sort of penalty. Free kick => Penalty without option to kick at goal => Penalty with option to kick at goal. The middle sort being for technical offences at the scrum, &c..

It's not easy. Hence I think that really being tough on yellow cards is integral too. Otherwise, like you say, cynical players will just kill the game and accept the penalty. Howsabout a yellow card for every third penalty conceded by a side? It's a bit of a nuclear solution but maybe it's the way. Points scoring matrices show the effect of going down to 14 is really important

I like your idea of some offence between free kick and kickable penalty

 

[david k]

Yes, pointing out how it's RL fans like you who are doing the pontificating about the better sport. If you read the end of that line it even says "both codes have there good points and bad points"....

Which is the better version of the sport is completely meaningless anyway, let alone irrelevant to the Burgess saga over the last year.

It was you who changed the wording, so you take responsibility for saying it, you cannot post something then step away from it by saying it's irrelevant. Thought I'd brought this to a close but you posted again to keep it going, it's union supporters like you who keep having a go at league and then pretending to be impartial that are the real problem

 

[Wafer]

*sigh* I've not had a go at League, just some of it's fans like you repeatedly declaring it better.

 

[david k]

Which isn't common in Rugby League, and not a good argument considering the sales made by the RFU for their internationals.
Yet most stadiums have space available. Why are people choosing to watch games on TV instead of going to the stadium?
All very historical, when was the last time a player happened? You're basing your idea that RU fans hate RL on stuff that happened up to 120 years ago. I find most RU fans don't "hate" league, just that they're indifferent. Like I am indifferent to Union or Football.
I only watch Union internationals, I couldn't name you the starting line for England even. But I don't "hate" it, I just prefer League. League fans constantly go on about League abilities with ball in hand, and passing. True, league players are generally much better running and passing than Union players, but lets be honest. The standard of kicking in league is atrocious compared to union, the technical tackling aspects in union are also higher skilled than league. They're 2 different games, with different emphasis on different areas.
As a long term league fan, the only "hatred", I hear is from RL fans about RU.
Plus, the RFL can learn something from the RFU about how to arrange and market the game.

Phil, what's rugby union internationals selling out got to do with rugby league getting more fans than netball? Why bring up Union in that sense? Think you have lost the thread, nothing to do with Union in that sense
My experience of the hatred was about a month ago when I was last down there, so I'm not basing it on 120 years ago only, but it also cannot be ignored and brushed under the carpet so they don't have to face up to it
Who has said they hate Union? I didn't I said I don't hate the game

Sorry mate but you seem very naive, I used to think like you but after traveling and speaking to people in RU areas the snobbery is alive and well. Maybe if you only speak to people in RL land you only see one side of the story.

 

[david k]

*sigh* I've not had a go at League, just some of it's fans like you repeatedly declaring it better.

In my opinion it is better, so why shouldn't I say it is?

 

[david k]

*sigh* I've not had a go at League, just some of it's fans like you repeatedly declaring it better.

Also no different than a Union supporter saying Union is better, or do you claim no u ion supporter has ever said that