Tiny saunter on bike turned sour...

[magnatom]

Out of interest Cab, how many times have you contacted police about incidents in the past?

 

[Nigeyy]

Well glad to hear you are alright. Maybe next time you could throw some mud from your allotment at his "off road" 4x4 to give it a truly authentic look!

I'm with you on reporting dangerous driving to the police -I can't imagine anything would get done where I am either. There has to be blood and body parts on the road before any intervention is done.

I'm not a legal person, but here's a question for anybody who is:

In my local town, if there is a dangerous pothole, after someone reports it they have 24 hours to fix it. Once it's been reported, and after 24 hours it becomes the town's responsibility to fully pay any damages. Point is, once notification has been given, unless the town takes reasonable action to remedy the situation, they may be liable for a large injury/vehicle repair bill. It usually means the potholes are fixed pretty quickly.

Can this work with a dangerous driver? If it can be proved a driver has been careless or dangerous and is reported (e.g. if there is video evidence or at least one or more independent witnesses) could the local county police then become liable for damages if they do not take some sort of reasonable action? It seems to me the only way for police to take something like bad driving seriously is if it really becomes a funding/legal problem. This might be a way to prevention rather than reaction once they've mown down a cyclist another time. Just a thought. Of course, it could be that the police are far busier with other issues that may be considered "more serious".

 

[nethalus]

Went down to the allotment on Saturday. Got the spuds in.

It isn't far, and I don't take the camera down there because its a bit of a pain storing it away in the shed while I'm working (to avoid another accidental near burial, which happened once). Besides, its one straight road, one corner, uneventful.

Black 4x4 overtook FAR too close on the main road. I was in primary, so I had swerve space, no problem. He wasn't going anywhere fast, the lights and the end of the (straight) road were red, and I could already see from the position they were taking that the two cars at the lights would be turning right. One of them, the one at the front, even indicated to do so while waiting (a rarity!). The overtake wasn't careless, it was aggressive; you have to judge a close overtake of a cyclist in primary with great care, and he had plenty of room for a careless but safe overtake, if that makes sense.

Black 4x4 was maybe fourth or fifth back from the junction when I got there. He'd swerved right in to the pavement, presumably assuming I would be filtering kerbside. I didn't, I went around the outside, in around the back of the two cars presumably turning right after making eye contact with car 3, waited in a decent secondary next to the right turning car (catching that drivers eye, nodding acknolwedgement of each others presence - its all going pretty much as you'd hope so far). I was going straight on at the junction, so my road position here suited me fine.

Moved off as the lights changed, black 4x4 also went straight on. I was well into primary position when he passed me, while in the process of doing so swerving sharply towards the kerb and braking hard. Had one of those 'now where do I go...' moments, yelled 'WATCH IT!', stopped barely with enough space, he of course had his window down and was yelling abuse. Okay, I thought, pay him no attention, can either wait here for him to reverse at me, dismount and wait for him to challenge me, or just keep going. Chose the latter, cycled around him, remained in primary. Antagonistic? Probably, but just breathing in this guys presence was enough to wind him up.

I was taking the next left turn, taking me to the allotment gates about 75 yards down that turning. 4x4 started off after me, yelling abuse through his window. Specifically, 'f***ing paedophile! paedophile'. Well, thats me told then. Someone who I don't know, don't want to know, who has just endangered me intentionally and who I have refused to acknowledge is now accusing me, from his car window and at high volume, of being a kiddy fiddler. That proves his case, that I am in some way an inferior road user, quite admirably. I turned off to the left and he followed me, right to the gates. I got off to open the gate, turned to face him, yelled 'get out and face me, or **** off'. He didn't get out, I opened the gate, closed it behind me, stared at him, and cycled off to my allotment. He could by now see that there were plenty of other people taking advantage of a glorious saturday morning on the allotments, clearly didn't fancy taking on a bunch of people armed with garden tools, did a cumbersome 3 point turn and sped off.

Just goes to show, even on the most ordinary, short trips, on quiet weekend roads, you only have to meet one mental case and it ruins things.

Reporting such things to Cambridgeshire Contabulary, even with footage, is a joke. So I'm not reporting this one. I'll just look out for this lemon and next time I get some video of him. Plod won't do anything even if I do, but I see little else I can do.

What amazes me about this story is that if the guy was in such a hurry to get somewhere that he absolutely had to be in front of you, why did he then waste his time going down a road he obviously didn't want to go down just to shout silly abuse? I can never understand people who do things like that. I've had people deliberately stop, unwind their window and lean out to shout out some meaningless abuse at me, just because they got annoyed that they were behind me for 30 seconds or less, but then if they were in a hurry why stop to shout out something that will be ignored anyway?

 

[slowfen]

Next time you get video of this sort of thing, try and report it, if that fails send it to the Cheif Constable asking why the force condones such behaviour. And is not interested in the legitimate safety of other road users.

Failing that the BBC or Anglia local news desk would be interested in the lack of action by the police.

 

[Jacomus-rides-Gen]

Next time you get video of this sort of thing, try and report it, if that fails send it to the Cheif Constable asking why the force condones such behaviour. And is not interested in the legitimate safety of other road users.

Failing that the BBC or Anglia local news desk would be interested in the lack of action by the police.

Turns out that local Aunty gives even less of a damn than the police. Tried. Failled.

 

[MER Veteran]

I get the odd acehole on my commute.If it happens once I keep well out of the way stopping if I have to.

 

[ufkacbln]

If you need to get hurt - get hurt!

Avoiding actions, can cause you to put a foot down awkwardly and twist an ankle, braking can strain a wrist......

If it resolves later and you don't need medical treatment, then that's one of those things.

 

[ufkacbln]

Do not take this the wrong way - I am NOT insulting the POlice.

Many years ago there used to be something called "Intelligence" and reports like this were filed and kept. I had an incident in Plymouth I felt serious enough to report, so went off and did so.

Very nice Constable looked at some files and then took a statement.

His parting shot was alongthe liness that they would investigate.

Two days later I had a visit, apparently I was the third person who had complained about this driver - one was another cyclist and the other a pedestrian on a crossing.

They had decided that although they could not actually prosecute they had visited and "shown him a yellow card" effectively letting him know that complaints had been made, he was on their books and highlighted as a risk.

I don't know how effective it was, but this is where the importance of these reports used to lie - everyone has a lapse now and then, but once apattern begins to show....

 

[Cab]

Out of interest Cab, how many times have you contacted police about incidents in the past?

Gosh... Theres a question.

Here in Cambridge, there was the one where the bus came straight at me in a narrow section of road in front of Magdelene college where traffic going my way had priority (took a heck of a lot of 'retraining' of bus drivers, which took consistent complaints both to the company and police, for about three years, before busses stopped doing that so often)... Think I took that one to plod four or five times, dozens of complaints to the bus company too. Eventually that one was racked up as a victory, in that the bus drivers very rarely do that now, and when they do its clearly because they haven't seen rather than because they don't care (they no longer hurl abuse when stopped for it, they stop and apologise). Plod achieved nothing in any of this, despite obvious danger.

Then there was the bloke who got out of his van in the same place tp push me off the road because I was stopped there, with insufficient room to safely pass his oncoming van I had little choice. That one had an independent witness too. Plod were reluctant to take court action, because they didn't think it was worth it despite it being dangerous driving, assault, leaving the scene of an 'accident', etc., but did send a PC round to drivers work place to tell him not to do it again. Then there was the taxi driver who yelled threats at me for the same thing in the same place, following this up by getting out to threaten me. Plod on desk tried extremely hard to talk me out of reporting this as a crime.

I recall another where a car hit me from behind for having the audacity to stop at a 'keep clear' box because (a) I couldn't have got out of the other side in that traffic and ( a cyclist wanted out. That one was a gentle and clearly intentional nudge followed by refusing to stop at the scene of the incident, with a CCTV camera pointed right at us. Plod would not allocate time to look at the footage.

Then there was the lady at a forward stop box who was so angry that I used said box that she yelled at me, opening and slamming the door in sheer rage, I made the mistake of turning to see what was happening so she moved forward into the box to challenge me, lights changed, challenged me to move off in front of her, I naturally dismounted, she got more frustrated, wheel span through the junction, parked on the other side of the road, got out, came back and tried to start a fight with me in front of two witnesses (who, it has to be said, were baffled). Reported that to plod via 999 emergeny a few minutes later because (1) she was clearly insane, (2) she was probably under the influence of something or other, (3) she had left the keys in the car, the engine running, the door open, with her child strapped in to a seat in the back, and (4) she'd kill someone acting like that sooner or later. Plod took details, checked back to say that it wasn't a real number plate so they would be taking no action.

A few others here in the last nine years or so in Cambridge... That would be about 12 or so? All about as bad as the most recent one, or usually worse.

Never reported such things happening anywhere else that I've lived because, frankly, they have never happened to me anywhere else I've lived. Mistakes happen on roads in other places, all of the time, but the only place I've encountered such frequent malice on the roads as a cyclist has been Cambridge.

 

[PBancroft]

Are you a part of any cycling groups in the area? I mean, is there anyone else you can group together with to make a fuss?

One person saying "this must stop" can sound a bit lonely and you may be treated as such.

Ten or twenty of you saying it makes a bit more of a noise. I'd be tempted still report to plod but also make a case to local news stations and rags. Again, one person saying it is easy to ignore, but more people writing in makes it a bit more interesting; A bit more newsworthy.

 

[magnatom]

You've certainly had some run ins cab. It puts what has happened to me into some perspective!

I am still waiting to hear back from the police about my incident, so it will be interesting to see what they say.

You could always write to the police in your local area and quote the quote I had from Strathclyde police.

We would advise anyone who feels their safety on the road has been compromised to contact the police in the first instance.

You could ask them do they agree with it. If they do then you are in a strong position in the future when something does happen to point out that they have suggested that you go to them in the first instance. It couldn't do any harm.

 

[Cab]

Are you a part of any cycling groups in the area? I mean, is there anyone else you can group together with to make a fuss?

Not locally. In the CTC.

One person saying "this must stop" can sound a bit lonely and you may be treated as such.

Ten or twenty of you saying it makes a bit more of a noise. I'd be tempted still report to plod but also make a case to local news stations and rags. Again, one person saying it is easy to ignore, but more people writing in makes it a bit more interesting; A bit more newsworthy.

I actually find that our local campaigning group, Cambridge Cycling Campaign, are more of a hindrance than a help. As in when you bring things up with the County Council planners (as in "this cycle lane is too narrow, its not compliant with guidelines from the DoT, it forces cyclists to the side of the road in a space too narrow when they should be in the middle of the lane as reccomended by Cyclecraft because theres a road constriction, a traffic island there") they tend to hide behind their links to the CCC ("But we regularly consult with the CCC"). My impression is, sadly, that CCC like sitting on committees and feeling important, and they really shy away from kicking up a fuss.

 

[Cab]

You've certainly had some run ins cab. It puts what has happened to me into some perspective!

Most days are fine. Its like I've always said though, Cambridge roads are angry, really, really angry.

I am still waiting to hear back from the police about my incident, so it will be interesting to see what they say.

You could always write to the police in your local area and quote the quote I had from Strathclyde police.

We would advise anyone who feels their safety on the road has been compromised to contact the police in the first instance.

You could ask them do they agree with it. If they do then you are in a strong position in the future when something does happen to point out that they have suggested that you go to them in the first instance. It couldn't do any harm.

They're quite clear that they DO want you to report such things when you get in touch with them by any kind of official channel. That just doesn't match up with what happens when you go and report something.

Alas, I've only got so many campaigning hours in me before I can't be doing with it, and cycling isn't always my primary 'action' area.

 

[magnatom]

Alas, I've only got so many campaigning hours in me before I can't be doing with it, and cycling isn't always my primary 'action' area.

So what's your focus cab, of you don't mind me asking?

 

[Cab]

So what's your focus cab, of you don't mind me asking?

Depends. For a while it was the section of road in front of Magdelene College, changing behaviour of the main bus companies there. Then a small amount of campaigning on certain other local issues (specifically how the city council handles, or rather doesn't handle, issues like fly tipping, refuse management, handling sudden appearances of 'travellers' in public areas, etc.). Also been involved in assorted campaigns on food issues, often on sustainable and ethical livestock issues including campaigns against supermarkets selling badly/misleading labelled products.

Its all about picking targets where I think I might have a fighting chance; when it comes to Cambridgeshire Police taking cycling issues seriously, I'm not sure that I do! Still, the success you've had with your film clips is quite inspirational (even if the threats have been more than a little frightening!).