Verbal warning from employer

[rusky]

If it's a verbal warning then there's no permanent record. Check your companies disciplinary procedures. It's doubtful that they can issue what is effectively a written warning without 1st issuing 1 or 2 verbal warnings. Get this sorted through your HR dept. If your manager isn't following the procedures the HR dept are usually pretty keen to sort it out!

FYI, the employer doesn't have to issue any verbal warnings, they can go straight to written or final written.

I agree that a formal warning is a bit harsh for this but you don't say how late you were, if you called to say you would be late or apologised as soon as you got in the door.

If an employee of mine was late, say by an hour, didn't call to say they were on their way & I had to confront them when they did turn up, I would probably issue a written warning too.

 

[threebikesmcginty]

I don't know what the OP does, how critical it is that he be there on time and how late he actually was on this occasion. But there seems to be a lot of knee jerk response that being warned about it must mean he is faultless and the management is incompetent and exploitative without any knowledge of the realities of the situation. Leaving 15 mins late is hardly a massive amount of unpaid overtime

The OP could be a work-shy shiftless oaf for all we know (no offence!) but management didn't follow procedure and an employer attending a tribunal is guilty until proven innocent, you've got to get it right.

And if he did 15 minutes every day they'd be getting a free week and a half a year!

I think there's a lot of companies at the moment who are hot on disciplining workers as it's cheaper than paying redundancy if the economy goes even more tits up.

 

[Red Light]

The OP could be a work-shy shiftless oaf for all we know (no offence!) but management didn't follow procedure and an employer attending a tribunal is guilty until proven innocent, you've got to get it right.

And if he did 15 minutes every day they'd be getting a free week and a half a year!

I think there's a lot of companies at the moment who are hot on disciplining workers as it's cheaper than paying redundancy if the economy goes even more tits up.

Seems to me they did follow procedure. He had a verbal warning and then a letter to confirm he had had a verbal warning. Which is the appropriate first step - had to do it myself several times.

As for the free 15 minutes a day, show me an employee who doesn't accumulate 15 minutes during the day getting coffee, having a non-work chat with colleagues etc. I am not saying you shouldn't do any of those but there has to be a bit of give and take on these things. If you want to clock watch to the minute on leaving time don't be surprised if other people want to clock watch your working time to make sure its all used working.

On your last para. I agree there is a bit of that going on but the other side of it is if you are going to have to make non-voluntary redundancies it is probably better to engineer it when the opportunity arises to protects the good, conscientious workers over the ones that are less so. Otherwise you end up having to deal with everyone on a level playing field and it is not good for morale when everyone can see people who are good getting made redundant and some of the people they were carrying getting to stay. There is just a strong feeling of injustice, and rightly so, when that happens.

 

[threebikesmcginty]

Seems to me they did follow procedure. He had a verbal warning and then a letter to confirm he had had a verbal warning. Which is the appropriate first step - had to do it myself several times.

I don't think so. It started off as an informal warning which is just talking over the matter, a note of this may be kept on your file but that's it. Following up with a letter makes it a formal verbal warning - as the OP was not advised in advance that this was the case therefore procedure was not followed.

There was a time when "clock out and f*ck off" was standard procedure but we're past those halcyon days now!

 

[asterix]

Refuse to accept it. I've only had one warning in 30 years. When I received one, I refused it and after a protracted process they sacked my manager. He was a bully and had deliberately made female staff leave through his abusive tactics. (Hire them, sleep with them, fire them)

(The fitter coming to put a bigger radiator in, didn't turn up at all Tuesday (son in hospital). Supposed to have been here at 09:30, van's broken down! I offered to pick him up in mine but he's fixed to borrow a car and even so will be at least an hour late. (Ce'st la vie..)

 

[Melonfish]

for a first offence i think a verbal is exceptionally harsh, however what you received by the sounds of it was not in fact a verbal warning.
technically for a verbal a member of HR must be present and you have to be notified that you are receiving a verbal warning.
receiving a letter from the company afterwards confirming your verbal is normal btw.

however i would refuse to accept this and instead raise it as a grievance with your HR team, you were not properly notified and for a first offence this is redonkulous!

 

[byegad]

Many years ago I was late for work. The then manager was a (insert rude word of choice, but make it really rude!) and issued a written warning to me. I stopped doing anything before or after my official times, and waited. Sure enough the (insert another rude word of choice, but make it really, really rude!) picked up on it and mentioned that I didn't seem to be 'pulling my weight'. I answered that at least I hadn't been late, coming in or going home!

This would all have ended up with more warnings and possibly a punch on the nose, from me, but the (insert yet another rude word of choice, but make it really, really really rude as it's your last chance!) retired. Funnily enough the person collecting for his leaving present didn't come to ask me for a contribution, and I'd been carrying half a brass washer around in my pocket for weeks.

 

[cd365]

It is normal procedure to document that you have had a verbal warning, hence the follow up letter. What the company should do is after a period of time, remove that letter from your files. I would confirm what the process is.

 

[Belly]

Seems to me they did follow procedure. He had a verbal warning and then a letter to confirm he had had a verbal warning. Which is the appropriate first step - had to do it myself several times.

Can I just clarify...I was not given a verbal warning, in that nobody said anything 'verbal'. The first I knew about it was when I was given a letter which stated 'This letter consitutes an informal verbal warning'. Anyway, it all seems to have settled down now.

 

[Red Light]

I am assuming the "apologising to the boss when he talked to me about it" was the verbal warning bit and the written letter was just to confirm that it had taken place. A written warning would have set out in writing what you have done, what improvement is expected of you and over what timescale and what will happen if there is a repeat or insufficient improvement.

 

[Belly]

Redlight. I spoke to the boss on the phone after the 'incident'. It was along the lines of - Me: 'Sorry about that, won't happen again.'
The boss: 'Okay, just make sure it doesn't happen again.' And that was it. Anyway, like I said, it's all sorted now.

 

[Belly]

FFS, this 'verbal warning' stuff never happened when I was a journalist. Being a Bus Driver is a bit different.

 

[citybabe]

Should he have made it clear in the meeting that he was issueing you with a verbal warning?

 

[Red Light]

(The fitter coming to put a bigger radiator in, didn't turn up at all Tuesday (son in hospital). Supposed to have been here at 09:30, van's broken down! I offered to pick him up in mine but he's fixed to borrow a car and even so will be at least an hour late. (Ce'st la vie..)

C'est la previous jobs not finished yet excuse

 

[Mr Phoebus]

FFS, this 'verbal warning' stuff never happened when I was a journalist. Being a Bus Driver is a bit different.

Now I see why you're in trouble.