What wheelset? What price?

[HLaB]

I'm confused, what's the point in spending 100's or even 1000's on a new wheel set, if you wont see any improvement over a set of Shimano R501s, and if this is the case;

Then this isn't true?

If you are pushing at the upper end of the wheel speed spectrum an upgrade in terms of weight/ aerodynamics makes a massive difference. If you are pootling along cycling a lower speed a new wheel set (unless the old is damaged) makes little difference. I hope that makes sense

 

[Mugshot]

There are many reasons why you would want to fit wheels other than R501s. But the more you pay, the more you are subject to the law of diminishing returns.

Ok I can understand the diminishing returns bit, but not so much the many reasons.
Reasons could be comfort, longevity, noise level but I'm starting to struggle a little now if performance isn't included.

It may be true, but whether the improvement is due to the wheels is highly dubious.

 

[Dusty Bin]

Ok I can understand the diminishing returns bit, but not so much the many reasons.
Reasons could be comfort, longevity, noise level but I'm starting to struggle a little now if performance isn't included.

Two issues - weight and aerodynamics. LIghter wheels are usually more expensive. Lighter wheels will be of benefit if you are climbing, or racing, as they make the bike lighter. Aerodynamic wheels are also usually more expensive. Aero wheels may be useful in TTs where you are riding at a relatively high speed (probably 25mph+). The gains in both cases are relatively small - but potentially worth it under the right circumstances.

 

[Mugshot]

If you are pushing at the upper end of the wheel speed spectrum an upgrade in terms of weight/ aerodynamics makes a massive difference. If you are pootling along cycling a lower speed a new wheel set (unless the old is damaged) makes little difference. I hope that makes sense

Not quite I'm sorry, I'm trying very hard honestly. The more you can put in the more you will get out and vice versa? So a set of R501s are not capable of returning what (extreme example I know) Froome could put in, but I would be unlikely to put in sufficient to see the benefits which his kit offers?
May I ask what you think it was which enabled you to make such a difference when you changed your wheels, I assume the PCC 10 is a 10mile TT?

 

[Mugshot]

Two issues - weight and aerodynamics. LIghter wheels are usually more expensive. Lighter wheels will be of benefit if you are climbing, or racing, as they make the bike lighter. Aerodynamic wheels are also usually more expensive. Aero wheels may be useful in TTs where you are riding at a relatively high speed (probably 25mph+). The gains in both cases are relatively small - but potentially worth it under the right circumstances.

So there is a benefit to be had in average speed but only if you are good enough to achieve it and you will only see anything more than a marginal gain if you are starting with equipment which is well below the level of your ability?

Edit for clarity I hope.

 

[HLaB]

Not quite I'm sorry, I'm trying very hard honestly. The more you can put in the more you will get out and vice versa? So a set of R501s are not capable of returning what (extreme example I know) Froome could put in, but I would be unlikely to put in sufficient to see the benefits which his kit offers?
May I ask what you think it was which enabled you to make such a difference when you changed your wheels, I assume the PCC 10 is a 10mile TT?

Yip the PCC10 is a 10mile time trial.

So there is a benefit to be had in average speed but only if you are good enough to achieve it and you will only see anything more than a marginal gain if you are starting with equipment which is well below the level which your ability will get the best out of?

Yip, thats a good way to put it. Also like mugshot says the improvement from a old £130 wheelset to a £300 wheelset is massive IME if you can achieve speeds to get the most out of it (you are at the threshold of speed where marginal gains are important) but a the difference between a £300 wheelset and a £1k wheelset isn't notable at my level.

FWIW, I borrowed a £1k front wheel last week and I can't quantify it but I don't think it performed much better than my £70 Khasim, it maybe did slightly but its certainly a decreasing return.

Beyond the performance factor though there also the 'bling' facto though

 

[Mugshot]

Beyond the performance factor though there also the 'bling' facto though

Ahh yes, arguably the most important thing to consider.
It's actually thanks to you I'm on this thread anyway, having read your comments on the Aksium thread concerning the wear indicator it struck me that I'll be needing some replacements before too much longer. Did you go from the Aksium to the Quattros or are we talking about several years and maybe different bikes between the two sets?

 

[Dusty Bin]

Like HLaB, I would be happy to recommend quattros, incidentally. 1) they look great 2) the weight (around 1700g) is pretty good considering the price and rim depth and 3) the build quality is very good. My lad has a pair on his bike and they do look the biz.

 

[HLaB]

Ahh yes, arguably the most important thing to consider.
It's actually thanks to you I'm on this thread anyway, having read your comments on the Aksium thread concerning the wear indicator it struck me that I'll be needing some replacements before too much longer. Did you go from the Aksium to the Quattros or are we talking about several years and maybe different bikes between the two sets?

Several years in between. I went from the stock wheels on the bianchi (campag Khasim, circa £150) to the Quattros (circa £300).
FWIW, My Aksiums were on the old Sirrus (put on when I upgraded it to drop bar, previously Alex Ace 19). That was a good upgrade too (un measured though). I then got the old Kinesis which came with Quasar wheels (IIRC a Dutch entry level wheel, possibbly lower performing than the Askium). When the Quasars wore out the Aksiums were pressed back into service (marginally better IMO). I then put Model B's on it (a similar level wheelset). I then put 2nd hand Mavic Kysirum Elites (similary a massive increase for me comparing (circa £150 to £300 wheels).